Erin King is here, y’all! Erin is a best-selling author, 3x entrepreneur and the CEO of the Socialite Agency. She’s helped clients ranging from The Academy Awards in Hollywood to The United States Navy at the Pentagon communicate more compellingly using her award-winning PUB method. If you gravitate towards my energy and the things I teach about (thank you, by the way) – you are going to love Erin!
In this episode we talk about her new book, You're Kind of a Big Deal: Level Up By Unlocking Your Audacity, and how to take bold action. We also talk about the role patriarchy plays in oppressing women’s confidence and how, instead, we can harness Big Deal Energy (the feminine version of Big ‘D’ Energy) to live an audacious life.
In this episode you’ll hear:
- Erin shared her experience pitching her then company, PMS (a tampon delivery service) to a room full of men. (6:30)
- Leveling up in your personal and professional life takes much more than just confidence and courage… it takes something bigger, bolder and grittier: AUDACITY. (23:55)
- Some ways you can begin to activate your audacity to level up. (31:45)
- Big ‘D’ energy aka Big Deal Energy: knowing you have what it takes. (35:59)
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Erin King has helped clients from The Academy Awards to the United States Navy show up more powerfully from behind the screen using her award-winning “PUB” method.
She is the Amazon best-selling author of “Digital Persuasion” and started her first two companies–Jump Digital Media and PMS.com-before the age of 30. She is the Founder of Socialite Agency, a social media firm which was featured in Forbes. Socialite’s clients include ABC/Disney, Mercedes-Benz Fashion Week, VISA, Siemens, Hitachi, Mutual of Omaha, Johnson & Johnson and dozens of others. Her podcast, Highlights with Erin King, discusses big ideas from the best nonfiction authors in the world.
Erin competed in the World Irish Dancing Championships and played NCAA Division 1 lacrosse but NOTHING has toughened up today’s communication expert like navigating the world of being a brand-new dog mom to a cavapoo named Stevie Nicks. Off-duty Erin is playing outside in either Laguna Beach or Jackson Hole with her crazy Alabama husband Hartman. You might also find her hiding from all of the above behind the covers of a nice, good book.
Erin King 00:00
Big deal energy is it allows you to kind of surround yourself in a feeling of capability, but in a way where you really believe it and if no one else does, it's not your problem.
Andrea Owen 00:13
You're listening to Make Some Noise Podcast episode number 392 with guest Erin King.
Welcome to Make Some Noise Podcast. Your guide for strategies, tools and insight to empower yourself. I'm your host, Andrea Owen, global speaker, entrepreneur, life coach since 2007, an author of three books that have been translated into 18 languages and are available in 22 countries. Each week, I'll bring you a guest or a lesson that will help you maximize unshakable confidence, master resilience and make some noise in your life. You ready? Let's go.
Hey there, everyone. Welcome to another episode of the podcast. I am so glad that you're here. So, so glad. I wanted to remind you that next month in July, I'm doing a free webinars/workshop. I feel like it's going to be more workshopey. I like, I like it when you all can come to things and not just listen to me talk. Like I want you to actively participate in changing your life, shifting your life. Changing your life is a little dramatic. Shifting your life, learning new things, gaining insight and self-awareness to some things maybe that you want to change that you want to do better in your life. So it's coming up on July 29. And it's for people who have pre ordered my book, Make Some Noise. If you have not pre ordered it, head over to AndreaOwen.com/Noise. Or if you already did, and you're thinking how do I get all these awesome bonuses, Andrea, that you speak of? AndreaOwen.com/MSN, acronym for Make Some Noise, and you can fill out the little form there and get all your bonuses. So the webinar is called Make Some Noise: Define Your Personal Power To Get More of What You Want. I was going to sing it but I will. I will spare you. I will spare you that. So again, AndreaOwen.com/Noise to find out and pick where you want to grab the book. I'm so excited for you to read. And then AndreaOwen.com/MSN if you have already purchased it, whether it's audio book, e-book, or print and grab your bonuses.
One quick thing also, I know that I've been repeating it on every podcast intro. If you're not following me on TikTok, it's super fun. I am, they're super short, quick videos. Sometimes I'm funny. I try to be. Amateur comedian. I think that even that's a stretch. But it's just a fun app. It really is not just teenagers dancing. There is that too. But as I've told you, the algorithm will figure you out, it will show you videos that you like. And it's just fun. It's wildly entertaining. I am over there giving life advice and making fun of the personal development industry a little bit because we can't take it too seriously. And sometimes I repost them over on Instagram reels, but it will only let you do them if they're 30 seconds or less and tick tock video sometimes or one minute. I'm @HeyAndreaOwen, on both of those platforms. So come and say hi, come and say hi. I'm just having a whole lot of fun over there. And I would love to see you.
Alright, Erin King is here. And you may have seen me talk about her new book on my Instagram Stories a couple of weeks ago, she sent me a copy of her book. And I like her so much just as a human. She's fantastic. But I also like her because she and I are a lot alike. So if you like my personality and the things that I teach about, you're going to love this interview and her book. So for those of you who are just hearing about her for the first time, let me tell you a little bit more about her.
King is a best-selling author, three times entrepreneur and the CEO of the Socialite Agency. She's helped clients ranging from the Academy Awards in Hollywood to the United States Navy at the Pentagon communicate more compellingly using her award-winning Pub method. She's the author of Digital Persuasion and You’re Kind of a Big Deal, which both draw from her personal and professional experiences. Having founded three companies before the age of 40. Off duty you can find her either mountain biking with her husband Hartman, facetiming with her huge, crazy Irish family, or being an annoyingly extra dog mom, to a cavapoo named Betty White. So without further ado, here is Erin.
Erin, I finally have you on the show.
Andrea, it is so nice to see you. And thank you so much for having me. I'm so stoked to be here.
I am so happy you're here to you and I had to cut us off or else we would have just just talked and talked and talked. I can tell that you and I are a lot of like, and when I saw the title of your book, I knew that I had to have you on because I know that you can see me on video but the people can't. I'm going to show you this really quick. That I have this this nameplate, it says ‘I'm kind of a big deal’.
Which is the title of your book, You’re Kind of a Big Deal: Level Up by Unlocking Your Audacity.
Yes. Well, I love that you have that name tag, because that's the whole idea, right is to constantly remind ourselves that we have what it takes. we are more than ready, and we are going to kill it.
We're gonna crush it. We're gonna do it. We're gonna do the thing. And just reminding ourselves, that's half the battle, right?
Yes. I'm glad I've had a lot of coffee this morning. All right. Can we start by? Can you tell the story that you tell? I feel like it's in the introduction of your book. It might be in the first chapter when you were in a meeting with a bunch of dudes and you had an experience. I know I'm making it sound a lot sexier than it really was. It didn't mean to set it up like that. Can you tell this story for the audience?
Sure. Well, let's just flash it back to the year 2014. The hot song on the radio is Taylor Swift’s Shake It Off. And the hottest startup in the world in my opinion was my startup which was a tampon delivery service called PMS.com. So we are $1 Shave Club for women's monthly healthcare needs. And Forbes magazine called us the tampon fairies because we were ‘period prep magically delivered monthly’ ding. So I've ever been that gal reaching into the stall and being like “cute shoes. Sorry, this is awkward. You have a tampon?” You know, it's like the most uncomfortable position to be in. And so I thought this this was the biggest idea. Turns out no, it's not. Most women just get them at the grocery store like a responsible adult. Not that big of a deal.
So the story is before PMS.com flashing it back to prior to that where I was raising capital from a basically a long boardroom full of Newport Beach Alfa bros, the the cross fitting, Ferrari driving, super tan dudes and holding up a tampon talking things like absorbances and flow all kinds of sexy nouns like blood and cramps. And they ended up backing me on this venture, a seven figure raise for for the venture and, and, you know, when I was pitching it, they all looked super grossed out and like they were gonna throw up and like vomit their sashimi lunch all over the beautiful, you know, conference table. And I remember just like the sweat going down my Spanx and be like, what am I doing, and I just, like, lost, all focused. I was like, I'm gonna crumble. I cannot do this. I was shaking. And one of the guys grabbed one the tampons, and he threw it at one of the other guys and was like, I dare you to open one dude. And he was like, I dare you. And all of a sudden, this tampon hot potato game broke out in the middle of my very important investor pitch. And I remember just thinking to myself, like, this never happens on Shark Tank like what was happening.
No, that happens in fifth grade sex ed classes.
Totally. And in that moment, like instead of completely just falling apart, I remember thinking to myself, like, why are dude so good at just making light of a situation, they just don't take it so seriously, not afraid of looking stupid or gross. They don't care if it's inappropriate, they don't, they just go for it. And they do them. And I call it like a dude-atude you know, they just kind of really do it. And in that moment, I was like, you what, screw it, I had a right to be here just like they do. And I kept doing the pitch. And they they backed me on the on the venture. And it was 18 months of a lot of learning about FDA regulations, and Chinese shipping policies and PR and marketing and sales, ecommerce, all the things and ultimately, 18 months later, I had to go back into that boardroom and I had to eat a shit sandwich because not only were we not the next Dollar Shave Club, but I didn't even get them any return on their investment.
So it was the it was the pretty much darkest, lowest biggest failure of my career. I started like losing all my hair in the shower and start getting my period and was like, you're such a fucking loser. Why? What's wrong with you? Like this was so stupid. And there was there was at one point where I just realized that, you know, in our darkest, deepest moments are rock bottom moments and I've read yours from your books. And we've all had that moment. Mine was I had $100 cellphone bill that came in and I've been featured in Forbes and I couldn't pay $100 cellphone bill, after all of the work and you know, all the different jobs and it's been like 13 years of busting my ass and I'm like, I can't pay a cellphone bill. Are you kidding me? And that was rock bottom for me.
In that moment, I discovered what we often do in our shittiest failures, which is that in my superpower was revealed in that dark hour. Because PMS.com the company was a disaster, but PMS.com the community was the internet's largest place where women on Facebook were coming together and sharing brownie recipes and memes and jokes and studies and women were coming together and really connecting, there are millions and millions of conversations. And so I was like, I'm a shitty CEO, but I didn't manage to build this vibrant social communities so maybe that's what I'm supposed to do with the world. And that discovery, and that failure led to starting with one client at my kitchen table. And over the last 10 years, working with some of the world's biggest brands, everyone from The Oscars in Hollywood to the United States Navy, helping them build social media communities.
So that was kind of my third time's a charm venture because I had some stuff before PMS.com too that I tried, but it took a lot around painful, a lot of debt, a lot of crying, a lot of failure. But if you're in a season right now, where you're like, out of excuses, and you're just looking at yourself in the mirror, like maybe it's you, look really hard, because that's what you'll find the thing that ultimately will propel you to where I am now, which is writing books and coaching and teaching and my finances are stabilized and my confidence is back. And I'm not crying in the bathroom and eating too much, you know, to me, peanut butter cups from Trader Joe's or too much wine, I'm just, you know, able to sort of help the world with what I know how to do, but only discovered it by falling flat on my friggin face. So that's the PMS story.
I love that story for a couple of reasons. And I don't want to step over the part where you, because I see myself in that meeting. And I feel like you're a more composed, and maybe professional person, especially in my 20s I would have lost my shit. When the guy started throwing tampons, I would have so angry and called them immature and stupid, who knows, I might have been able to hold my composure, especially when you know, seven figures of VC was on the line.
I want to just acknowledge not only the confidence that you had, but the ability to pivot and sort of just say like, why not me? Why not me that I can, I can show up and ask for just kind of meet them where they're at, for, for lack of a better expression, meet them where they're at. So I guess my question is, were you born with that kind of confidence? Or did you, was that a learn type of thing? Like what was going through your mind at that moment? Like what else?
You know, I, some people do ask me that question. They're like, how did you get that level of confidence, and my cousin's used to call me delusionally confident as a child, which I'm pretty sure is the term I use. I'm pretty sure it's a backhanded compliment. I'm not sure it's like the nicest thing to say to someone. Like, why do you think you're so great when you're not? But you I don't know, the part of the story I've got to tell you is that, um, I grabbed the tampon out of his hand and used it as a microphone for the rest of the presence and a pointer. So as a part of this, I mess up the story, but that that's the part that was kind of like the game changer.
But for me, it was like, you know, I guess looking at situation and just thinking to yourself, okay, there are like literally three options right now. You know, you're either going to, you know, somehow become some superhero and rise above and become perfectly polished, which is impossible, right? Option number two is you're just gonna crumble and cry and run out of the room. Or option number three, is you're going to improv this shit, you're gonna ‘yes and’, and you're gonna grab the tampon, you're gonna, like you said, meet them where they are, and you are going to just not take it so seriously, and do your dang best. Because the thing is, I feel like as women, a lot of us, we really we put in the work. We put in the work to be there. I mean, I had like, worked so hard on the idea and the concept in the deck. And when you put in like 100 hours working on something, you deserve to get that damn presentation, whether they're listening or not, you deserve to be at that tempo. You deserve to, to have your voice be heard because you've earned it.
So I think that the key is not like being born with something or, you know, reading so many Pinterest glittery coffee cup mugs or incredible books like yours, maybe. But maybe the whole idea is just to know that you've put in the work, you do have what it takes, and that, you know, you're not curing cancer, you know, you're not it's it. This is not the end of the world. This is like you just show up, do your best and the sun will rise again tomorrow. You know, I think it's just kind of your perspective. And that's the dude-atude I was talking about with guys is like, you know, they can go for it. They can step up, they can, they can do big things. But at the end of the day, I mean, they don't blame, they don't blame themselves for the failure. They just blame the thing. They blame it was the pitch, or it was the client, or it was the, it was the thing. It wasn't them.
Whereas women tend to blame themselves.
Yeah, we do. So I think I'm embracing a dude-atude, which is mimicking the positive parts of otherwise tox, toxic masculinity, I think sometimes can be a little dose of just helping us get over that hurdle.
I love that. That's a great example of take what you want leave the rest with toxic masculinity. Right? I've talked about on the show my mild obsession with Cha Cha de Gregorio from the movie Grease. I think that she's such a forgotten character and just doesn't get enough credit and symbolically like her confidence is just off the charts. You know, telling people that she just meant that she's the best dancer at her school, snatching the trophy from the teacher and waving it around. Like she just, she doesn't give a shit. And, and I often asked myself like, well, what Cha Cha do, I was corresponding with this guy. It was this loan thing. And, and I was actually had a conversation with my husband about it, because the way he was correspond with me via email was so incredibly different than the way that I have correspond with my colleagues and friends that are women. He sent me an email and it was like Andrea with a colon. And it was like, and he told me, he was gonna send me this list of paperwork that he needed. And he just listed it out. No, like, here's the list of things I need. Or like, hope this email finds you well. None of that was just a list. Yeah. And you didn't even say like, kind regards, Daniel. No, it was just. And it struck me that day for some reason. And I just, I just thought to myself, what if I could, like the amount of time I would save just by switching up my emails.
And anyway, I could go on and on with with how we are. But I love that you focused on that. The perspective of having choices, I think, in many, many situations, we have choices. We can either bet on ourselves or not. And if you think about it, I just have really come to the conclusion now in my mid 40s, where I think to myself, there are very few people who are going to bet on me. The list is short, you know, it's my closest family and friends. Because people are too busy worrying about themselves. I have to bet on myself. I have to. And that's what it sounds like you do too in those moments.
Did your friends and family always bet on you?
Um, there's been moments where they haven't like when my whole life fell apart. And I was telling everybody that I was going to become a life coach. They were like, um, are you sure? Are you sure you're gonna change careers right now but for, no, but I find being underestimated highly motivating.
Yeah. Elle Woods syndrome. I love a good Elle Woods. I really do. I love that so much. And, you know, I was asking you because, you know, my friends and family, they shoot me so straight. And they of course, they love me, they back me. You know, my sister's actually here visiting me. I have not seen her since 2019. So I'm thrilled. My family's coming on Wednesday. Like, we're all super tight. We're like, I'm so lucky. I'm so blessed. I love my people. And you are never a prophet in your own land. You know what I'm saying? So, every time but like, you know, like Christmas, my family will be like, well, this is our son. You know, he works for Google. This is our daughter. She works for the not. And then there's Erin the oldest. She like writes books, but like is on Twitter like we don't they, tell him what you do honey.
She makes funny videos on the internet.
I think if you sit around, even with the most supportive family and friends, if you sit around waiting for someone to authorize or justify or green light that what you do matters, you are going to be waiting forever and ever. Amen. So I think we do have to authorize ourselves ASAP and, and I’m gonna bet you it's almost like there's almost like a gateway authorization that has to take place like that initial like gateway drug, where you really bet on yourself that one time and you're so scared and you're so terrified. And then you wait for the world to end and everything to collapse everything to fall apart. And you open your eyes from squinting and you're like, huh? Everyone's fine. This is okay, this is cool. And all sudden you open up this whole other realm and you realize the possibilities are literally endless. And that's when it gets exciting.
That is and and I don't think that people have to have that big, monumental moment. It happens to some people but even like the smaller moments can be amazing too. Okay, let me move on to these these other questions that I have, because we'll just we'll go off on tangents.
So where do you look for answers and get unstuck when you find yourself at a personal or professional crossroads? Or did did we already answer that? Is there more more tips you have?
Well, in terms of getting unstuck, I mean, just like you I'm a voracious reader, and I'm just constantly looking around for the grittiest gals that I know. The grittiest women in my life who just seem to know what to say or know what to do. And there's a chapter in my new book I say it's called ‘Keeping Up So You Don't Cop Out’. And it's about borrowing other women's capes borrowing other women's superpowers until you can find your own. It's not fake it till you make it and it's not not being yourself. And it's not… It's just channeling like, we all have that friend that knows just what to do. And that one situation whether it's a sales opportunity, or fundraising opportunity or dating. We all have that one gal where you're like she would just know exactly what to do. And you just use it as a starting point just to get you out of the rut just like a little push out of the mud. And then you're off to the races and you can let yourself shine through and channel through but oftentimes it's just getting started out of that rut where I would just turn to turn around me and say who, who would know what to do right now and I just borrow that superpower I really do.
I love that. I have I read about this in my book too. Have you ever heard of the imaginary Board of Directors exercise?
No, let's hear it.
Okay. So this is from my friend and colleague Susan Hyatt had us do this exercise and I knew I had to tell everybody about it because I found it so helpful. And now it's a screensaver on my computer. So you basically just make a list of like, if you could have a board of directors, who would be on it? And doesn't have to be women. Mine is all women, but not necessarily and they can be characters from a movie like Cha Cha de Gregorio or they can be real people like Michelle Obama, Ruth Bader Ginsburg. And you have that handy you either you know, put it on your phone as your screensaver or your computer or, you know, you can even you know, print them out and put them on your wall somewhere where you see them so you are reminded of the attributes that these people have. And I look at that similarly to what you were talking about these people in your life that have you know, that the one person that knows just what to do,
I love that so much. So I've heard about creating your own Board of Directors before but I love the fact that you're actually tangibly making them within eyesight I view. I have a friend. His name is James Taylor, funny enough. And you're talking about, about goal setting and he's one of people that I would he's a guy obviously but I would channel him when it comes to systems and goals because he's so he's methodical one of those who just set the time blocking in the planner and you're just like, how? He was talking about goal setting and I'm like, I'm a Post-It girl. I have my Post-It's all over the place. I have my cheerleader Post-It notes, my girl Post-It notes. I had my to-do’s. My whole life is just a sea of just Post-It’s everywhere. And he was like, well, what's the biggest goal that you have right now? Like what's the biggest scariest one I was like, oh my god launching my new book. He's like, where is that Post-It note right now. Like where? Where is it physically in your space? And I looked and it was like the furthest post it note away from my desk. He was like you need to make your biggest scariest hairiest Post-It note within arm's reach physically to where you're sitting every day so that you know that you can actually touch it. And there's this like physical sense of like anchoring on like the goal, or the people, or just bringing it out of our minds and out of our just awareness into like the physical space, that I think, to your point just pours gasoline on igniting that manifestation in a way that is so powerful.
That's incredibly symbolic. I love that. I put money in various places. And it's, you know, sometimes they're $20 bills, but it's mostly like $10s you're using for bookmarks and things like that. And it's to remind me, I don't remember where I heard that from, I don't remember if it was Jen Sincero’s book or another money book that just to remind you that it's everywhere, and that it's within your reach, and it's there when you need it.
That's so good. I love that so much.
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Talk to us about audacity. So what is audacity mean to you? Cuz I know that that's like a buzzword among like Millennials and Gen Z right now. And it's the subtitle of your book. So tell us tell us what you mean by that.
There were a lot of books written about confidence. So I was like, what's like the next step from confidence? What's like this sassier, older, bolder cousin of confidence. And I was looking at a different you know, you and I both love language, and I was looking at different words and audacity is one of those words people are like, oh, you know, the audacity to do this. It always sounds kind of negative. When you read the definition, it's kind of cool. I mean, it's it's daring, boldly, daring greatly, which is very sexy and romantic and Brené Brown and everything. And we’re all like yes, we all love to dare greatly. But then there's a caveat. It says even if it might shock or even offend. And that's the brake screech. And everyone's like, oh, well, this is like a canceled culture space. We don't want to offend anybody. We don't want to we don't want to like shock anybody like we like the sexy daring greatly part but not the like caveat that may come with it. When you think about right the greatest…
I think especially for women.
Especially for women. To your point yes. And and as women like shocking and offending, like we're just not allowed. We're not allowed to really do that. And so this book is about how do you unlock what I call your big deal energy, which is the ticket to being able to operate in that audacious space. Because anything you are doing that is big and juicy and sexy and exciting and massive, even if it's a small thing, but it feels big to you, it is going to take a certain level of audacity, because when you're taking big actions, you are going to elicit big reactions.
And so this book is all about reframing people's rejection or pushback or way in or whatever, at you reframing that, reprogramming our good girl, ghosting your inner good girl brain from like, ooh, red light, scary pause on the brakes to reframing that and actually, like big actions drive big reaction. So maybe people's big response is actually a green light. Maybe it's actually a blinking indicator that you're actually finally on the right track to making it happen.
So that's what the book is all about. And there's all these different strategies around unlocking your big deal energy and what that means and how you step into that. And, and a big part of that is like, you know, one of the chapters is called your fears or fake news. And talking about all of the fake news narratives that we as women, particularly again, then, for the most part, and how you can start to unravel those and rewrite those.
Okay, you're speaking my language over here. I love that. And I love it. This is this is dirty talk today. I also love taking words back. And my friends and I have been talking about the word conceded and how much, how much I love the word conceded partly because in middle school, I don't know if it's the same now, but I was in middle school in the late 80s. That was a long time ago. And can be called conceded even in high school was the worst thing you could ever be called. And I'm like, I want to take it back. Like hold on. Let me let me let me see what Siri says about about what is the definition of conceded. Define conceited: excessively proud of oneself. Vain. Excessively proud of oneself. And why not? Like why not be excessively proud of oneself? I love I love love love that so much. Like yes, let's have the audacity and even even the word opportunistic. Like I know that I've used that negatively and you know, describing some people but then I'm like, why not? Yeah, attention whores, opportunistic conceited, audacity?
Yeah, okay so I love where you're going this because all of these words are I think they are ways of external forces, tribes, society's way of trying to, trying to throw off a movement that makes them feel uncomfortable. That makes them feel… I think that their reactions to us using these labels in this language, their their reactions are really just reflections of how what we're doing is making them feel.
So when we're taking up space, when we're making the big move, when we're making the big ask, when we're saying the conceded audacious insert, controversial adjective here move, it forces them to look at their own choices and their own life and their own world through a lens they'd rather not. And so, and so it's it's that it's this, it's this idea that like, you know, you can either listen to your internal GPS, which I call the inner GPS lady, or you're looking for answers externally, you're googling, you're asking your friends and family, you're copying everyone, Instagram, whatever. I mean, you really have two spaces to turn for a guide for a compass.
And, and I think the thing that's interesting is, like, we do we know that deep down, we know, we know that feeling, you know, they feel when you're in flow, you know, when you're in line alignment, you know, when you are out of alignment. Yeah, and you know, when you're not right. But that's because intuition, our intuition is individual, like intuition is not a collective experience. Like, like, the like, the the herd does not have intuition, right. Like you have intuition. Only you. And so it's interesting that we know, we're the only ones that can make the call. We know we're the only ones that know the direction to go. We know we're the only ones that are chasing down the goal, the dream the thing, and yet we still allow the cacophony around us to weigh in with those types of, of get back in your space, get back in your place, get back in your box, limiting adjectives, and it's interesting to call those out. And to use your word reclaim them back.
Okay. Yes. And it's all of those things. And it's our, our culture has created this conditioning to I believe, to keep us quote, unquote, in line, and by us, I mean, women, yeah. To keep us in our own lane so that we can continue to have the way that the system is set up, and it's you know, and it's patriarchy and like, let me always say I always have to give that to claimer patriarchy hurts men too. Yeah. And yeah, but it's it's that it's those words. And it's funny. I was reading your book, you quote the same Pew research that I did in my book about. So talk about that, that they did research about certain words and attributes that were looked at negatively or positively for men and women. And what did they find?
Oh, gosh, that was insane. So for your new book, you quoted this one?
It was it was a recent study, like 2018.
Yes. And when you read, it didn't just stop you dead in your tracks like you couldn't unread it. And all you want to do with like, unknow, this was real? This study was saying that in guys in 2018, not in 1918, not in 1818, right?
Not in the 1950’s.
They literally had these adjectives and it was like, it was like, ambitious, leadership, confidence, all these like positive adjectives. And it basically had everyone ranking it from favorable to not favorable. And these powerful adjectives ranked as favorable for men, and non-favorable for women in 2018. And then the adjectives beautiful, kind, compassionate, were ranked as most favorable for women, and not for men in 2018.
Yeah. And it was the word powerful was the one that hit me the hardest.
Totally, totally. And, and it wasn't like, there was no neutral ranking. It wasn't that people were kind of on the fence. It was a like a hard no. It was a hard no, when it came to power for women in 2018. And it was a large study, it was like 8000 people or something that they asked across all demographics, all ages across the United States, all different regions. Um, it stopped me in my tracks, and it just was a great punch in the face reminder that as far as we've come, we have so much fucking work to do.
That's yeah, that's one of my biggest points, too. Is it’s it's a it's a yes and. Yes, we have come a long way from women not being able to get credit cards without their husband's permission for being able to vote, like those types of things, and there is still so much work to do.
Okay, so how can a woman activate their audacity? What tips do you have, whether it's in their personal life or their professional life?
Well, one of the things in the book that we talked about is what you said earlier, where I was, like, you know, you have to, there's usually a groundbreaking, like a gateway moment where you cross over, and then you realize that you actually can that the should is bullshit kind of thing. And you totally pointed that out. And that is exactly what the book is about is that we do these little exercises throughout the book It's called ‘The Big Deal Diary’. And there's these little challenges throughout the book, where you just try small, audacious moments just to see what's going to happen. And the most incredible thing is like that it's it's this muscle that we are exercising in the smallest ways.
I can tell a story in the book. And I'm very clear, I'm like, look, this is not Malala fighting off the Taliban brave. Okay, this is not Bethany Hamilton arm eaten by a shark heading back to the lineup tomorrow break, this is like hashtag basic, AF brave. And a lot of us only really get medium brave opportunities. Not all of us get to see an ‘off the Taliban’ moments to see what we're made of, you know. So there is a whole part in the book where I talk about the fact that I'm a speaker, like you and I was doing a lot of corporate gigs for a long time. And I was wearing these high heels and I hate heels because I was like a toddler. And like I'm going to fall and get hurt. My dogs are barking like 20 minutes and and so I always wear sneaks to the performance carry the heels that maybe they get off, reverse, you breathe you sigh you're like, why? Who invented these heels? And I know SJP had us all convinced Sex in the City that it was like the answer with the Manolos is false. I disagree.
So anyway, so I was backstage and I was just like, staring at my heels and like, I don't want to put you on I hate you. And my friend Brian Hanzo, who's amazing, had a challenge in social media. And he said, I want everyone to just step into one small, brave moment today and tell me what it was. And when you said step into it, I was looking at the heels and I was like, I don't want to step into those. And so I just I remember I was backstage and I was like what if I just like wore these black high tops.
where they Converse?
Yeah, on stage with like a bright pink like J Crew preppy. This is not a look. Okay, I'm not saying to begin with, but this is not a look. And it was a professional financial, mostly male crowd and they're so judgy about your outfit, and you're already a woman under 40. They already don't want to like you, whatever. So I'm like I'm doing it. So I just wore the sneakers out on stage. And it sounds so dumb, but I was so nervous. Like I was just like, this is not okay, you can't do this. I ran out on the stage at I was crazy. I was sweating through my Spanks. I was an upper lip sweater. There's a trend here. I'm a sweater and I was just dying. And it was the craziest thing because I ran out on stage I could like lay down and jump around. And I got my very first standing ovation of my entire speaking career wearing these damn shoes. It's a dumb thing to do. But I walked offstage and I was like, oh, just step into who you are. Even if things are gonna judge you. Even it it's gonna not work or fail. Be stupid or not be allowed something so dumb as a pair of sneakers unlocked this whole chain of reactions of audacity moments. And so it's moments like this in the book that we try to uncover for you as the reader. Like, what is the pair of sneaks that don't go with the outfit? That is not appropriate. But that might potentially unlock this whole new level.
I think I saw a picture of you. It looked cute. No, no, they were at least like some classic shoes and not like some like New Balance like mall-walker shoe. Yeah. I feel like it worked.
Thanks, Andrea. You're sweet. Oh, my gosh.
Yeah. Well, I'm, Mel Robbins has made a speaking career a very good one at that wearing tennis shoes on stage.
That's true. My pair's like sparkling he had long she rocks it for sure. It's a mood for sure. But whether it's snakes or whatever the book is about, like, what are those like little random things that you just feel like you just you can't do that. But can you? And what might happen, you know? So that's the book is like uncovering what that is for you.
Yeah. Okay. I love that. I think we have time for just one more question. So can, let's, I want to talk more about this big deal energy, which is I love partly because it's I know, you know, a spin-off of another big D energy. So can like tell it just tell us about that.
Okay, so we know Big D energy, for those of you who are listening is is a phrase that has been kicked around the last couple of years, which is used to describe men who just have this presence. They have this quiet sense of self, this confidence, they just know who they are, they don't have to brag about it, they don't shout it out, and they don't force it, it's very attractive. It's very sexy. stands for big, d-i-c-k energy, okay? In case you guys don't know, break it down.
So big deal energy is the feminine version of that. It is unlocking that sense of, I do know, I deserve to be here, I will take up space. I don't have to necessarily shout about it. And, and shove about it and and be a foghorn about it. But I know I have what it takes and everyone around me is going to know too. It's a different approach of tackling the toughest crossroads, the highest stakes scenarios, even just to get unstuck little everyday moments, like the sneaks that we're talking about. It's finding out ways to unlock that sense of deep self-confidence.
So the point of audacity in a way that does not involve learning more and doing more and being more and all the morning, it's, it's more about unlocking and doing doing less, it's caring, a little bit less responding a little bit less, worrying a little bit less. It's a reduction versus an addition type of strategy. And in the book, it's you know, I always say that the worst advice anyone could ever give, ever the most ridiculous advice ever is: just don't care anyone thinks about you. It's like, that is insane. Okay, we would never post on social media, if we didn't care about us. First of all. Number two people who don't care what they think about them are narcissists and psychos and sociopath’s, sociopath, that's no, that's true. I'm like, not kidding. That's true. Of course, you're gonna care because you're human. And you want the people that you love to love your thing. And you have empathy and you want, you have yes. Okay?
So what audacity is about is finding the comfortable place for you, where when it really comes down to it. Being heard, taking the stand, quitting the people pleasing, authorizing yourself, doing the damn thing when the stakes are the highest. It's about caring more what you think about your decision than what everyone else thinks and how you can do that incrementally in a way that doesn't feel undoable and idealistic but feels very like today. Here's the thing we're going to try. The big deal energy is it allows you to kind of surround yourself in a feeling of capability, but in a way where you really believe it. And if no one else does, it's not your problem. Right. And that goes back to betting on yourself. Totally. And it full circle. You did it Andrea is your first podcast. I think you have 400 episodes of professionalism under your belt. That was brilliant. A tiny bit of practice. I love your show.
Okay, everyone needs to go out and get your book. You’re Kind Of A Big Deal: Level Up By Unlocking Your Audacity. Where do you want people to go? I know that you're active on Instagram. I follow you over there. But where else?
I'm in the club these days. Are you up in that club Clubhouse are you doing it?
I am up in the club, but I don't see a lot of my people there because I, you know, I talked to people who aren't entrepreneurs. I feel like clubhouse is a lot of entrepreneurs.
Yeah, it is a lot of entrepreneurs, that's for sure.
So if people are entrepreneurs listening to this go follow you on Clubhouse.
And if not, I'm on Instagram or ErinKing.com is all the things all the podcasting and the the courses in the community and the love and the love notes and all the things.
I'm going to be on your show later this year. I cannot wait about my book and not wait make someone want to talk about my book Make Some Noise. We are going to make some noise over there. Everyone. Thank you so much for being here. You know how valuable I know that your time is.
And remember, it's our life's journey to make ourselves better here. And our life's responsibility to make the world a better place by everybody.
Hi there, swinging back by to say one more thing. You know how I'm always giving advice over here on the show and on social media. And a couple of those things is that I'm always telling you to ask for what you want, be clear about it, and also ask for help. So I am taking a dose of my own medicine and I'm going to do that right now.
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