This week I’m coaching Hannah, a twenty-five-year-old who recently transitioned from working in a non-profit to Corporate America. She came to me for some coaching and insight around issues of wrestling with perfectionism and her battles with negative self-talk. We talked through different scenarios and by the end of our time together, Hannah said our conversation was a “self-awareness wake-up call”. 

In this episode you’ll hear:

  • Hannah describes her feeling of being stuck and lack of motivation. (5:28)
  • We discuss the idea that the lack of motivation she may be feeling is due to burnout. (11:15)
  • The importance of female friendships and how they can be a huge part of a path towards self-care.(14:38)
  • Recognizing there are seasons of your life where you simply aren’t motivated and that’s okay. (32:00)
  • Encouragement to get curious when something is pushing you in a certain direction or belief. (41:58)

And by the way, we’re looking for your stories about how you’ve made noise in your life. It can be tangible stories like how you transitioned from one job to another or internal work – such as how your self-confidence grew over a number of years. Listeners, you are such a major part of this show and I want to honor your voices and stories. We need to hear more women’s stories. Head over to AndreaOwen.com/Talk to share yours with us. 

Resources mentioned in this episode:
Share your “Make Some Noise” story with us! Visit AndreaOwen.com/talk
Burnout, Emily and Amelia Nagoski
The Five Love Languages, Gary Chapman

Right-click to download the .mp3



Hannah 00:00
This is such like a like wake self-awareness, almost a wakeup call, and I love having this conversation with you.

Andrea 00:09
You're listening to Make Some Noise Podcast episode number 394.

Welcome to Make Some Noise Podcast, your guide for strategies, tools and insight to empower yourself. I'm your host, Andrea Owen, global speaker, entrepreneur, life coach since 2007, an author of three books that have been translated into 18 languages and are available in 22 countries. Each week, I'll bring you a guest or a lesson that will help you maximize unshakable competence, master resilience and make some noise in your life. Are you ready? Let's go.

Hey, everyone, welcome to another episode of the podcast. I am so glad that you are here. I've been so excited to do this intro for this particular show. Because this is the day I get to tell you that we are looking for your stories. I've mentioned it a couple episodes past that it's coming. And it's officially ready for you to come and leave us a voicemail. And okay, I'm getting a little bit ahead of myself. So we are looking for your stories. Specifically how you are making noise in your life or how you have made noise in your life. So maybe you asked for a raise or a promotion at work. Maybe you set a boundary with someone and you were terrified to do it and you did it anyway. Maybe you quit a habit like overdrinking or something else that wasn't serving you. You had to muster up the courage to take big action, you know, giving your opinion, changing your relationship with money, your self-confidence has grown somehow. So these don't have to be, you know, big things where you took action and it's tangible. This can be the inner work as well. So for instance, if you, you know, did some I don't know, trauma therapy and EMDR and you were able to go and date again, or, or have a hard conversation with a parent. Or as I mentioned, you know, your self-confidence grew over a handful of years or something like that. We just want to hear how you're making noise.

And the reason is, is that I would love to share these stories on the show. And you listeners are such a major part of this show. And I want to honor your voices and honor your stories. We need to hear more women's stories. AndreaOwen.com/talk. All of the guidelines are on there, the step-by-step instructions super easy, you just click a button and start recording. And I can't wait. I can't wait to hear your stories and play them here on the show. And the reasoning is, as it's all around the theme of making noise. My new book is called Make Some Noise: Speak Your Mind and Own Your Strength comes out August 31. We're very excited about that. And this is one of the things that we're doing to celebrate. Is gathering your stories and putting them together for probably a handful of podcast episodes. It's more to come on how we're going to roll that out. And I just can't wait. I can't wait. Thank you for taking the time to do that. Again, AndreaOwen.com/talk.

And we have a coaching episode for you today. Hannah is here on the show. And I'm just so grateful that you that you applied to be on the show and come on and have conversations with me. And you will hear us have this conversation and may coach her a little bit around it. And then at the very end, stick around because I have an update for you and how Hannah's homework went. Alright, so without further ado, here is the conversation I had with Hannah.

Hannah, welcome to the show.

Hannah 04:20
Hello. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Andrea 04:25
I'm excited that you're here. And this topic that you brought was so great, and I cannot wait to jump in. But before we do, and before we get to the good stuff. Can you please tell the listeners tell us where you're from and what you do for a living?

Hannah 04:32
Yeah, absolutely. So I'm from Nebraska and I just transition from working in nonprofit to corporate America.

Andrea 04:37
Can you tell us how old you are? Because I think that might kind of directly relate to our conversation.

Hannah 4:40
Oh, without a doubt, I recently just turned 25.

Andrea 04:42
25. Okay, so a young woman, and congratulations on a quarter of a century big, big 25 and I am going to just jump into the deep end and you and I chatted before, you know a few weeks ago about what the specific topic is that you wanted some support with and it was mostly around the umbrella of perfectionism. So the way you worded it to me is you said ‘I feel as though I'm wrestling with perfectionism, constantly’, your words. And then you went on to say there is a lot of negative self-talk. So I'm going to continue with with what you had said on your application. And then I would love for you to tell us a little bit more about it. So you went on to say, ‘I'm hoping to find new motivation to move forward. I'm hoping for insight as to why I used to have big dreams, and now feel unmotivated and stuck’. So tell us more about that.

Hannah 05:28
Oh, without a doubt, I used to have so many big dreams and things I wanted to get done in life. And I feel like that got crushed a lot of it by me feeling like everything I'm doing is not enough. You know, I'm an imposter. I'm not trying hard enough. Last year in, you know, right when the pandemic started, I actually was fired from my first real job due to health reasons, which was, mean, absolutely crushed me. And I think ever since that happened, it's been really hard to pick myself back up and remain motivated to do everything I want to achieve in life.

Andrea 06:05
Okay, so tell me more about tell me… Okay, so just to gather a little bit more information. So you lost your job? Was it around like March or April of last year?

Hannah 06:15
I lost my job in June after going through severe health issues. So that was very hard on me.

Andrea 06:22
Okay, and so it wasn't because of your performance at work, it was because something that was out of your control, correct?

Hannah 06:26
Yes, absolutely. But I still took it personally. Sure.

Andrea 06:29
Tell us more about the perfectionism that you struggle with and the negative self-talk.

Hannah 06:33
It feels like especially in a work setting, no matter what I'm doing, how many hours I'm putting in how hard I'm working that, you know, is not enough, somebody is going to realize that, oh, I'm a fraud. I don't know what I'm doing. Especially in kind of today's environment, where we're working from home, especially in the new job, I've started, I feel like even if I'm working my eight hours a day, I'm gonna get questioned like, ‘oh, she's not doing what she's supposed to be doing. She's not doing this right’. Honestly, feeling unqualified for the jobs that I do have.

Andrea 07:12
Okay, so tell me, I'm curious as to the connection between feeling that way and then also, I mean, it seems like it's obvious, but I might I just want to make sure that I'm not missing anything. Like your your struggle with perfectionism and the negative self-talk, and then the motivation to move forward. So I'm curious about the stuckness feeling that you have, like what does that actually look like in your your day to day or week to week life.

Hannah 07:45
So now, when I started this new job, trying to kind of progress my career forward, I've created some new goals such as like climbing, climbing the corporate ladder, because I'm no longer in like a career field I originally started, which was more nonprofit work. And like, you know, I've done therapy, I love self-help motivation. But you know, the goals I set to me they seem on achievable. And I feel like I don't have a ton of motivation to work towards them. Like I do my job, I do what I'm supposed to do. But even in everyday life, even outside of work, just trying my absolute best and showing up for myself. I feel like that's such a big struggle. And I'm aware that I'm not always showing up for myself and being the best that I can be.

Andrea 08:31
Do you feel like your goals that you have, are they, absolutely and truly goals that you want to do?

Hannah 08:40
I think for the time being, yes, because I think my whole being 25 and being young, you know, your life changes your perspective on what you want in life absolutely changes. My original goals go into college, I studied criminal justice, I got my bachelor's and master's in that was to work with victims of sexual assault and sexual abuse, and to really advocate for women and advocate for policy change. And I've had such a drive towards helping people in that drive I feel like is completely gone now. And I can't figure out why or what I can do to get that back.

Andrea 09:17
Okay. Because it I have something that's like tapping me on the shoulder. Not literally, there's no one else in the room. Just this feeling that… So tell me a little bit about the job that you lost that nonprofit. was that more in alignment with those goals that you just talked about?

Hannah 09:39
Partially, yes. It was a nonprofit where we were advocating for children in foster care. And truthfully, when I look back on that job, it took me a while to realize it. I wasn't crazy about it, and I wasn't happy there. And so I do believe getting fired was a blessing. But I feel like that was working more towards helping people and align more with what I want to do.

Andrea 10:04
Okay. Again, just gathering a little bit more information because I'm trying to kind of parse it down to the issue. So the perfectionism and the…I know, we're talking about your career specifically because you're feeling unmotivated in it. But the perfectionism and negative self-talk, is it is it mostly in your career? Because you said, I struggle with perfectionism constantly. So does that mean it bleeds out into the other areas of your life?

Hannah 10:30
Oh, every aspect of my life, now I want to do everything perfect. And I feel like no matter what I do, whether it's work, home social life, it's never enough.

Andrea 10:39
Is there any diagnosed or undiagnosed anxiety or depression happening?

Hannah 10:45
I have been diagnosed with both currently don't require need treatment, I don't believe but…

Andrea 10:50
Okay. Okay. How do you manage? How do you manage let's talk specifically about your anxiety.

Hannah 10:56
I like to spend a lot of time in nature, obviously, in Nebraska, that gets very hard, especially in the winter. We're finally warming up, so it gets a bit better. But I spend so much time outdoors, walking my dog, doing yoga, exercising any physical activity really seems to help me ease that anxiety.

Andrea 11:15
Okay. It sounds to me and I don't want to go immediately into problem solving. But it's, I feel like, let me take off my coach hat for a second and put my mom hat on. And it sounds like, what might be happening is a couple of things. There's might be a little bit of burnout, which comes from probably go go go going when you were in college and getting your degree and then in that, that job, which which sounds, mentally and emotionally exhausting working, doing that kind of…that was a helping profession really is what you were doing. And then the bottom dropped out with the pandemic, and then losing your job and having those health issues like, on paper, like looking at that list of things, it sounds like the perfect recipe for burnout. What do you think?

Hannah 12:11
You know, I would agree with that I actually thought about and I'm like, Am I burned out? But now that it's been almost close to a year, I'm trying to figure out how long does it take to get through that? And what else can I do to move past that?

Andrea 12:25
Yeah, and it's, it's sort of on the forefront of my brain recently. And I've mentioned it here on the show before I recently read the book Burnout by Emily and Amelia Nagasaki, and, and it's, um, I recommend it unless you have a huge list of books that you're already reading, I don't want to add more to your plate. But it's in the, I think it's the first or second chapter, they talk about the stress cycle. And I love this book, because they they talk about the science behind it.

And by the way, burnout is a lot more common in people than we think. And I can't remember what, how they talked about it, or what the research says. But it's extremely common in women, because we tend to be the doers are what they have coined ‘human giver syndrome’, which is so incredibly telling. And it's again, very, very common, and that signs of what you're telling me are definitely pointing to that that's why I was asking you, you know, what are you doing to take care of yourself and, and there are tons of strategies that I could give you around negative self-talk and dealing with perfectionism. And I give a ton of those and especially in my second book, How to Stop Feeling Like Shit, but I I hesitate to throw that at you because I feel like we might be stepping over the the real foundational part of of helping you with this. And that is just the basics of taking care of yourself.

Hannah 13:53
Oh, without a doubt, I think self-care is very important. I think that's probably a basic concept I should pay a little more attention to.

Andrea 14:01
Okay, so besides spending some time in nature, which you just mentioned is super hard in the wintertime and we're recording this in spring so it's kind of you know, getting a little bit better but but what else do you do to take care of yourself?

Hannah 14:15
I like to take baths, I tried to spend some time with some friends unfortunately, I don't know if I have a full support group of women in my area who I can go to with problems or people who are fully supportive of me in that aspect. And I do think that's a huge drawback is not having a community of women who I feel comfortable with to deal with life's problems with.

Andrea 14:38
Do you have any like local friends their local girlfriends?

Hannah 14:40
Yes, I do.

Andrea 14:41
Okay, and I know COVID has really thrown a wrench in social get togethers but are they like on a scale of one to 1010 being you know, your quote unquote, ‘soul sister’, how close are you to this person or these people?

Hannah 15:01
You know, I feel like the majority of the friends I have out here are Friday night drinking friends. I have a few girlfriends I can go to if I did have, you know, need help, need that girl time and there's a few friendships that I'm really working on, like cultivating that with. But I don't know if I'm fully there yet.

Andrea 15:19
Alright, I’m interested in these girlfriends that because like, with the thing with friendships is and the reason that I'm I'm sort of honing in on this, just as a as a sidebar, is I fully believe that our female friendships truly, truly can fill the needs that we have that we might not even know that we need, you know, at your age, you've sort of it hasn't been that long since you've left your parents’ home. And and we're, you know, quote unquote parented. And then you're thrust into adulthood. And many times, like, we don't know how to parent ourselves. And we have to learn that through our own self growth, and through therapy, and reading all the books and things like that it's not, it's not really something somebody our parents set us up for, in many cases. And our friendships, you know, in my experience, and the experience of many women, our 20s are a time for us, finding out who we are what we're made of making mistakes and learning from them.

And, and friendships can be a little complicated, because a lot of the times we don't, we don't come with the tools to like you were saying, like, cultivate and nurture these friendships. So I am such a huge fan of, of giving people the tools to be able to have these beautiful, nurturing, supportive, reciprocal friendships. And it might feel awkward to have, like these vulnerable conversations with our friends, like, ‘hey, you know, I'd love to take this friendship to the next level’ type of thing. Not that I'm asking you to say that. But again, just as kind of a side note, I wanted, I wanted to talk to you about the reason that I'm pushing the importance of it on there. Because this is, this has the ability to be a huge part of your path for self-care, which then in turn, will help you struggle around the issues of perfectionism and feeling motivated and negative self-talk. Does that all make sense?

Hannah 17:25
Oh, absolutely.

Andrea 17:26
Okay, there's a method to the madness. I'm just just letting you know. Okay, so back to this question. Tell me about these friendships that, that you're working on cultivating what is what does that look like?

Hannah 17:34
So I have a group of friends that, you know, met them through a job I had previously and met a bunch of girls through there, a lot of it is just we can hang out with our significant others at the bar. There's a couple of girls specifically who I you know, I really get along with them, we can go out and do things that don't involve getting absolutely plastered, which I think is huge, especially for my age. That's kind of what everybody goes out and does. Right? I'm sure I do have that. But I feel like I don't I haven't met you know, or cultivated that friendship where it's like that person, my go to person who's always there, those go to girls who I can discuss anything with. And I think a lot of it is a personal thing. Or maybe I don't put myself out there. And I don't like being vulnerable. I'm trying to work on it. But it's been a big struggle for me to fully find those people where I want to, you know, open up to let them know, like, Look, I'm struggling, or this is my current problem.

Andrea 18:39
Tell me more about what you mean, when you said, ‘I don't know if it's personal’. What did you because you kind of you kept explaining and I wasn't sure if that's what you were covering? Or was that something else?

Hannah 18:48
I meant like, a personal like a personal problem, am I the one not doing enough to cultivate these good friendships and I do know that I'm very good at self-isolating myself, and maybe not reaching out to people when I need to, I'm probably the worst when it comes to contacting people, responding to text, making plans. I lack that initiative. So I do know I have responsibility in the fact that I lack these close friendships because I'm not putting my best foot forward to try and have them.

Andrea 19:13
Right. Which I mean, I just want to acknowledge is really normal. It is it is very, like you said it's very vulnerable, and feels hugely risky to put yourself out there and especially to reach out for help and say hey, I'm really struggling. Do you have 15 minutes to FaceTime or something like that?

So I I want to I say that because if you're beating yourself up for not being this go getter with new friendships you are you're certainly not alone. The so common no matter how old a person is, it can be it can be extremely daunting. So I always say you know, just once step at a time, one friend at a time. Is there anyone that you have in mind as we're having this conversation that you think might have potential to be a really great friend?

Hannah 20:14
Oh, absolutely. I, my two, three friends, Hannah and Courtney, I get along with them so well, and I know I can talk to them about absolutely anything if needed. And I lacked that initiative to reach out when I need a friend or discuss my issues with them.

Andrea 20:29
Okay. So how would you feel if I gave you the assignment and I and I want to co-create this with you. So if you have kind of a counteroffer that you want to put your input, I am more than willing to negotiate this assignment with you, you know yourself best. But I do want it to be at least somewhat out of your comfort zone. So Hannah and Courtney, and how do you feel about either having a conversation with them about this or even like having them listen to this podcast episode or writing them a handwritten card, and just, it might be twofold. So it might be you expressing your gratitude for their friendship. And it might say something like, you know, ‘friendships are super important to me and I'm so glad that I have found someone who gets me and I just wanted to write you this note to tell you how much I appreciate you’. And then also you say, ‘I would love to be the person that you reach out to when you're really struggling. And, and I would love to be that person for you or something like that’. Like what do you think about that assignment?

Hannah 21:36
I think I can handle it. I mean, a little out of my comfort zone, but nothing good ever comes out of staying in your comfort zone.

Andrea 21:42
That's true. Look at you Hannah, coaching yourself. Okay. Alright, so reach out to, and what what kind of correspondence do you prefer?

Hannah 21:53
Either a text message, a handwritten letter, either or for me.

Andrea 21:57
Okay. I always feel like handwritten letters or cards are the best. And we so don't do that very often. It's it's such a lost art and greeting cards are expensive now. So I just I think it's a it's a more special way of expressing yourself and communicating. Because we send text messages all the time. And I I'm asking you to have it be something that's slightly out of the ordinary so that it is more special to them.

Hannah 22:29
I completely agree. I think your handwritten note can go a long way. And that's something I think I would love to do.

Andrea 22:34
Okay, good. I'm glad to hear that you would love to do that. And how do you how do you think that they're going to respond?

Hannah 22:42
I think they might love it, we get along very, very well. We talk relatively often see each other relatively often. We've talked often about, you know, doing things that don't involve drinking and going to the bar and having activities and friendships outside of that. So I think it would really, you know, kind of hit home for them.

Andrea 23:03
Like, I'm just kind of giving you sort of the step-by-step process of what it might look like. And, and just a side note, again, like this is, you know, John Gottman’s work, he talks about trust building in relationships. And this is both for romantic relationships and friendships. And he says that trust is built in small increments over time. And this is exactly what what this is. I mean, it might be a seemingly small and kind of innocuous thing to do like a, you know, great send somebody a card. That's that's just revolutionary. And it and it really is. It genuinely is. To take the time to write someone a note and be thoughtful about it are these small increments of trust between the friendship, and then my next step, what I was going to say before is that, you and you know, listen, if you need to have a couple drinks before you have this conversation, I'm not gonna say you're wrong for it. But have you heard of The Five Love Languages? That book?

Hannah 24:03
No, I have not.

Andrea 23:05
Okay. The author’s name is escaping me right now. But it has been in print forever and ever. It's a short book and there's there's all kinds of different spin offs around The Five Love Languages, but it's it started out I'm pretty sure that it was based more for relationships. And it it categorizes these five ways that everyone likes to be loved or have their partner show them how they how they love them. So it's it's things like gifts, or acts of service, words of affirmation, quality time. And, and we have love languages, you know, with our romantic relationships, but we also have them in our friendships, and they may or may not be the same as they are in our romantic relationships. And it might be an interesting conversation to have that with your girlfriends, like how, how do they like to be shown that someone else cares about them?

Hannah 25:03
I love that concept. I absolutely love that concept.

Andrea 23:06
Yeah, and you might want to, you might want to buy the book, I don't know for sure, I'll find out after we get off the phone if they make five love languages for friendships. But it might be fun to just like get the book and say, I read this this book, it's a little corny, and you know, or my life coach told me to get it, you can throw me under the bus if you want to. And and ask them, you know, like, how do you what makes you feel like you are being supported in a friendship.

Hannah 25:40
And I think that's huge, because that's something I guess I don't know about my friends, and they don't know about me, how I need to be supported or how they need to be supported. And I think knowing how somebody likes to feel loved and feel supported, that's so important.

Andrea 25:55
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So I've been talking to you about meal kits here on the show. And I want to tell you specifically why I love Freshly. First and foremost, they're not a meal kit. They are meals that come already prepared and they're heat and eat in three minutes or less. I know. I've been using them consistently since at least 2018. It might have even been before that and I just I'm mildly obsessed with them. I tell everyone about them. So okay, first and foremost, every single meal is gluten free. If that is important to you. Their chefs cleverly swap and sneak in veggies to craft meals with unexpected twists. So every bit of it is as nutritious as it is delicious. There is little waste and everything is recyclable. You can also pick how many meals you want, you can pick what day of the week you want them delivered, and you don't have to get multiples of the same meal. So my husband and I and the kids like different meals so I just pick all of their favorites. So we've tried almost all of them I think and my favorites are the buffalo chicken with cauliflower mashed potatoes, any of their risottos. I'm 100% obsessed with their steak pepper corn, and my husband loves their ktown pork and purple sticky rice and the chicken lavorgna those are probably his favorites. My daughter loves the steak peppercorn. Although she picks the peppercorns out because they're they're a little spicy for her. But they do have vegetarian options too if that's if that's your thing. So if you head on over to AndreaOwen.com/Freshly you can get 30% off your first order. I love freshly so much I could talk about them for five minutes but I will not I will not let's get back to the conversation. AndreaOwen.com/Freshly and get 30% off your first order.

I want to circle back with you about finding the motivation to move forward. I know we were talking about burnout. And again, I don't want to I don't want to completely step over that. And I do think that the first thing that that needs to happen is is you taking care of yourself and you know Emily and and Amelia and Nagasaki talk about closing the stress cycle. And when people are in burnout, they need to do something that that helps them close that stress cycle. What we just talked about is one of their chapters about connection and friendships and things like that they also talk about physical activity and it's basically about taking care of yourself but let's kind of you know pull up 10,000 feet and and look at the kind of meta situation the meta view and look at your motivation. What are you what are your action expectations like what are you expecting, your your life to look like in terms of how you feel about the future.

Hannah 30:10
You know, I just want to be happy, I want to feel motivated, and I want to be driven, I used to have big goals. And as I said, I'm working with victims of sexual assault and sexual abuse as somebody who has been a victim of that and is went through hell dealing with that, I was so passionate and so on fire about working with women who have dealt with that. And I don't know what happened within the past year, year and a half, especially after losing my job, why that drive to help everybody and help women and be such a strong advocate was completely gone. I mean, I went to school for six years for this. And I know so many people don't use their degree necessarily, but like, the inner feeling I have, and why I did it. I feel like that's so important. And so my goal, maybe if that's not what I do with my career, which I think is fine. But my goal is to still have that drive to be so passionate about that topic and want to help people.

Andrea 31:13
Okay, how do you feel about, like, what if I told you, you know, I have some kind of magic eight ball or crystal ball that that says, oh, guess what, it's you're not actually destined to have a career in this. But it is something that you do volunteer work for? Or something like that? What, what would you think about that?

Hannah 31:35
I think it would be great. That's something that's been tugging on my heart lately, because I'm wondering, I don't think I'm meant to work in that line of work, because there's such a high level of burnout. The criminal justice field right now, there's so many negative connotations and bad things going on in that field, which is why I don't want to join it right now, due to personal safety and personal beliefs that I think volunteering might be the best.

Andrea 32:00
Yeah. Well, the reason I was I was asking about about your expectations, because from where I'm sitting, and now that we've been talking for a little while here, what's sort of glaring at me like, I feel like the whatever was tapping me on the shoulder about 20 minutes ago, has now moved into the corner of the room and is glaring at me. And saying that what is probably happening for you, but again, I don't want to put words and feelings in your mouth. So please tell me if I'm, you know, on the mark, or not at all, what might be happening is that, just like everything, this is a season in your life. And at your core, you are inherently a motivated and driven woman. It's part of your personality, like at your very, very best. And you will have seasons of your life, where you're just not. You're not motivated, and you're not driven. And it doesn't mean anything is wrong. It just means that this is the season that you're in. And it's sort of like, when you pull a rubber band back, you know, it's like in order to have that, that, that snap, and that trajectory going forward, you have to pull the rubber band back. So what if this is just the time of your life, and it might be a year might be a handful of years, where you're pulling that rubber band back?

Hannah 33:23
Oh, that is such a like a breath of fresh air to hear that and even kind of process it that way that this is just a season of my life. Because as I get older, I don't want to be stuck in this place forever. So I would agree it probably just as a season of my life, and I have to do my own inner work and inner healing probably a little bit more as well as taking care of myself to be able to, you know, shoot myself forward and get that motivation and drive back.

Andrea 33:53
Yeah, it just it seems to me that what might be happening and I want to give you a little bit of a forewarning because I can already hear your inner critic like waking up from a nap and going like, Oh, no, no, no, no, no. No, no resting. No, this isn't the winter season for Hannah and and I want to just, you know, again, give you a heads up that that might happen. And that's normal. And now you're not destined to be unmotivated forever. Anyone who goes to college for six years to study one thing is isn't destined to just sit around and like ‘I don't know’, you know, you're not going to be my age 45 years old and be like still where you are today. From what it seems to me like this is just almost your body and the universe and your guides and angels saying ‘hey, you know what, the last few years maybe the last decade has been a lot and let's let's rest for a little while. So we can can be the best version of ourselves a year from now, or however long it takes’.

Hannah 35:05
Oh, I just love that. I think it's tough being in your 20s for anybody being so driven and kind of pushing myself at such a young age and achieving so many goals that I set for myself, I was go go go for years on end, I think sometimes it's hard to forget that. I'm 25. And I don't think anybody in your 20s really knows what they're doing are totally what they want out of life. And I think I have to bring myself back to that perspective of, I still have a hell of a lot of life to live, and a lot of things to learn.

Andrea 35:39
You do and I like, if nothing else, I hope that you listen back to this part of the episode or what you just said, because that to me is your truest wisest self of self-speaking? And you're absolutely right. And I want to remind you that this time last year, when you had just turned 24, like this is that is that age for many is the beginning of their career, you know, especially if you went to college for something that you're passionate about you start your career. And then guess what, we have a goddamn global pandemic. None of us have experienced before. And I feel for you, you know, I had already and many of us listening have we already had our careers established. And yes, many of us faced, really difficult times. But we had a lot of working years behind us so that we could build up our skills and our experience and our network, etc, etc. You were just starting out. And and I want to acknowledge that as being extremely difficult and traumatizing. And you absolutely deserve a break and a season of rest to be able to recalibrate.

Hannah 36:49
Oh, thank you so much for saying that. I I definitely think I would agree with that. You know, the global pandemic was so hard on every single person, there's not one person that hasn't been affected, obviously, myself included. So hearing that and kind of processing that, that starting your career in this time is tough. No, that's again, a breath of fresh air for me.

Andrea 37:12
Yeah. What is your journaling practice look like if you have one at all?

Hannah 37:17
You know, to be honest with you, I have not journaled in a couple of months, but I was very big on it. probably for about the past two years, I would say like 2019/2020 every day, or almost every day, whether it was like writing down five things I'm grateful for or trying to get any negative emotions out and writing out my feelings but that's something I definitely have not been practicing lately.

Andrea 37:44
Okay, when you I thought you're gonna say two years I just if it's only been two months, like you're doing fantastic. I encourage you to journal on on really anything that we've talked about, but especially this this last section of what we've just been discussing about you know, this being a season this is your winter season, this is the season of rest for you, and rejuvenation and recalibration and and just see what comes up just completely free journal. See what comes up, see if your perfectionism and inner critic have anything to say about it because I definitely think it's important for us to sometimes give that voice so that we can see it for what it is and move past it. Do you think that you're in a place where you can do that with that perfectionism and inner critic voice?

Hannah 38:33
Yes, most definitely.

Andrea 38:34
Okay, good. And I you know, I usually give a ton of homework on on these calls into my clients not always it really depends. But you are definitely someone that I'm going easy on and it doesn't mean anything except like this is where the conversation went. The whole point of you, of you taking care of yourself How are you feeling right now about where what we've just talked about and and the direction that we went?,

Hannah 39:00
You know, I think it feels great. I think we kind of are signed up to talk about certain things again, the conversation moves in other directions and I really love that because it's a lot of self-awareness for me and realizing this is what I think the problem is, but here's what the actual problem might be and what I need to work on.

Andrea 39:18
I think so too. And you know, you said something interesting in your application. I don't remember I don't know if you remember that you said this but I like to ask people what kind of support do they thrive best with and you said ‘I need a path forward and accountability. I don't need empathy sympathy or for someone to tell me it's going to be okay. I need help finding my desire to shine bright again’. And I love that about you and to me and please again tell me tell me if I'm not right but to me that says like that was the that was your motivated voice but that was also a little bit of inner critic saying like, no, we the only answer is to push forward to have a plan. That is exactly what you want it to look like, and someone lighting a fire under your ass to get it done, which, by the way I'm great at but my intuition said that's not that's, that's not what's going to be of best service to you.

Hannah 40:13
Oh, I guess I didn't think about even that for me. I mean, I've gotten so much empathy and sympathy, my health issues this past year were very severe. And I have Crohn's disease, I've been relatively sick since I was 13 years old. And so I've gotten a lot of empathy and sympathy and people like, oh, you're gonna be okay, and kind of like babying me. And like, I don't want that. But I do think maybe I could use a little more of that. Understanding and loving nature, because I think after dealing with it for so long, or having people be so nice to me, I guess it kind of sounds weird. But to me, it's like I don't, I don't want that I want people to really push me forward and motivate me to do better, because I know I can do better. I don't always think that empathy and sympathy gets me anywhere.

Andrea 41:05
I invite you to journal about that. I think that could be like a whole different conversation for us to have. And it just it, that's very interesting. And I wonder if you can find some kind of balance in your life where you are letting people take care of you. Whatever that looks like, you're essentially letting people love and connect with you. And at the same time, be the motivated and ambitious young woman that you are.

Hannah 41:37
No, absolutely This is such like a like wake self-awareness, almost a wakeup call, and I love having this conversation with you. Because I am a very all or nothing person. I’m either 100% or I'm nothing. So I absolutely love that. And I think it would be important for me to find that middle ground. So that is something I will journal about to dig a little deeper on.

Andrea 41:58
Okay. Which is is very common in so many people, so many women is that dichotomous thinking of all or nothing. And honestly, what I what I help a lot of people do is find that gray area that that middle ground of what it might look like to have both really, you know, and and also get really curious, when you are feeling uncomfortable when people are taking care of you or asking how your health is and you know, do you get angry or resentful or irritated? And none of those feelings are wrong. They're just clues as to what's going on. Because what might be happening is you might have judgment around, you know, someone who does have chronic illness.

Hannah 42:48
Yeah. And you know, I can see that I think, especially during the pandemic I struggled a lot with, first I was very, very scared. And then I kind of got over being scared because like, what is everybody so afraid of being sick of? Like, I've been sick for so long? And so I do see absolutely that judgment, because to me after a while I was like, I don't know, being sick isn't that bad? So I guess there's a sense of normalcy, and that, for me that isn't there for others. So I didn't think my health has a big part to do with that emotional side of things in my emotional connection with others and how I want to be treated.

Andrea 43:25
Yeah, I think that was another one of my invitations to you is is exactly what I said is to just get curious when you find yourself pushing one thing onto yourself. So what I mean by one thing, and it might be when you're pushing yourself to find that new motivation, or you know, like you said, like insight as to why I used to have big dreams and I feel unmotivated and and why you feel that way about chronic illness. And it's just, again, it's just and I know you mentioned that you wanted some new insights before we started talking and and curiosity, itt does a few things. It releases, it helps you release any judgment that you have. I'm not saying it releases it completely. It helps you to release judgment you have around something like a belief that you're holding on. Helps you release that. And then also helps you gain clarity just through the thought process or the journaling.

Hannah 44:25
Oh, absolutely and I think gaining that clarity is huge. And even this conversation reminds me of you know how much more I still can learn and how much more gentle I need to be with myself and how much more curious I need to be because I love to figure out why I am the way I am. That's something I find fascinating. So it's very insightful.

Andrea 44:46
Okay, good. All right. So here's what I have down for you for homework. You're going to reach out to your friends Hannah and Courtney with cards, handwritten cards, telling them how much they mean to you, and whatever it else is that you want to write in there. And then hopefully the next step in that when you get together with them is talk about, you know, “love languages”, quote, unquote, and ask how they like to be supported in their friendships. And they may have never have thought about it before. So then it becomes a conversation where you talk about, you know, you might talk about times where you've been betrayed by your friends or you've been the betrayer. We I think we've we've all you know, had incidents where we've treated our friends not so well and, and how you feel about that. And then also, you're going to journal or do some journaling around this season of your life and resting.

Hannah 45:36
Wonderful. I'm looking forward to completing those assignments and seeing what comes from it.

Andrea 45:42
So this is what we'll do. Well, we'll reach out in a couple of weeks and see how you're doing and then I will give everyone an update. So they can they can see your progress.

Hannah 45:46
That sounds good. Yeah, sounds wonderful. Thank you so much.

Andrea 45:49
You're welcome, my dear. Awesome. All right. Be right back everybody.

Oh, my gosh, I cannot emphasize enough how important standing still is. I think so many of you can relate with being high achieving and just kind of moving all the time and feeling like your worth is dependent on your productivity. And that's not true. Your worth is just your birthright. And at the same time, we need to slow down we need to rest no human can keep going like the Energizer Bunny constantly that is not sustainable. So I hope this episode was helpful for you. Don't forget to head over to AndreaOwen.com/talk to leave us your stories of making noise. And remember everyone, it's our life's journey to make ourselves better humans and our life's responsibility to make the world a better place. Bye for now.