Yasmine Cheyenne joins me for a conversation about self-healing, self-boundaries, and friendships. She is a self-healing educator, author, speaker, and mental wellness advocate who helps people learn how to cultivate daily practices to build healthy, joyful lives. 

In this episode we also talk about the magic of community when it comes to self-care, the benefits of social media for the purpose of self-healing, and acknowledging that healing doesn’t make life perfect, it supplies us with what we need to have ease, peace, and joy even when it feels like the world is falling apart. 

Some other topics we explore:

  • Why self-healing is an important part of self-care (6:31)
  • Strategies to start your self-healing journey (10:57)
  • How creating boundaries can help you heal (11:23)
  • Self-healing is not something you have to do on your own, you can do self-healing with a therapist, coach, or safe confidant (25:24)
  • What to do when a friendship is not reciprocated (35:11)

Private coaching with Andrea
Consulting with Andrea
Andrea on Instagram
Yasmine’s website

Book recommendations:
You know how I love a good personal development book, right? I’ve compiled a list of book recommendations, as mentioned in past episodes. Check out these amazing book recommendations here. Happy reading!


Yasmine Cheyenne is a self-healing educator, author, speaker, and mental wellness advocate who helps people learn how to cultivate daily practices to build healthy, joyful lives. With an online community of over 150K and as the host of The Sugar Jar Podcast, corporate giants including ABC, Meta (Instagram), and Skillshare have invited Yasmine to share her transformative teachings around self-healing which she also offers through keynote speeches, corporate presentations, and one-on-one coaching. Her instruction has helped tens of thousands of students take control of their mental and physical health by creating boundaries, designing their dream job, finding the love of their life, and more. She recently was also a speaker at TEDxRutgersCamden on the topic of “How Boundaries Make Space For The Sweet Things In Life’’, and her expertise has been featured in top media such as The Today Show, Forbes, InStyle Magazine, Refinery29 and more. Yasmine believes in “Self-healing For Everyone™”” and with the launch of The Sugar Jar® Community app, she’s created a safe space to develop self-awareness, learn boundaries, and find resources to support your mental health. Coming next, in January 2023, Yasmine will be releasing her first book, The Sugar Jar (Harper Collins.) The Sugar Jar will show readers that through little adjustments to set boundaries and nurture our energy, we can create more balance and joy in our lives.

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Yasmine  00:00
We have to be willing to understand our internal voice and so when we start with ourselves and we start asking ourselves those tough questions, when we start having those internal conversations, we're able to integrate all of the healing work we're doing in the outside world, within our lives. And until we get to know ourselves, we're not able to do that as well. And I think that's why self-healing is so important whether you're doing it with other people or whether you're doing it solo.

Andrea  00:28
You're listening to Make Some Noise Podcast episode number 481 with guest Yasmin Cheyenne.

Welcome to Make Some Noise Podcast, your guide for strategies, tools and insight to empower yourself. I'm your host, Andrea Owen, global speaker, entrepreneur, life coach since 2007, and author of three books that have been translated into 18 languages and are available in 22 countries. Each week, I'll bring you a guest or a lesson that will help you maximize unshakable confidence, master resilience and make some noise in your life. You ready? Let's go.

Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of the podcast. I am so glad that you're here. I am recording this for the first time in a very long time with my dog in the room. And you may remember me talking about her we have a German Shepherd puppy. She is seven months old now a time of recording. Her name is Astrid, and when she was very, very young, I had her in here when I was recording an intro I think once and then after that it just can't happen. She's just …she's way too playful. She's trying to like chew my face. You know, just it's just not working out that. But yesterday, unfortunately, it was a Sunday, and I spent…my husband was with me part of the day, about six hours, in the emergency vet. Originally I thought she had a bowel obstruction. It's a long story. Turns out she doesn't. She actually has pneumonia. Aspiration pneumonia. I'd never heard of it before, but it explains her cough and some vomiting and lethargy. I go home that night. And what do I do? I Google it. Dogs die from this. You have got to be kidding me. The vet didn't mention that. I just, I looked at the abstract of one study, I didn't even look at like what kind of dogs It was what size breed anyway, but it was like 79% of dogs ended up fine, but 21% of them died within 30 days. Anyway, she's in here with me. This room also doubles as a guest room. And so she's on the guest bed. She slept with me last night. She's usually a very good girl and sleeps in her crate. But she was with me last night. And it sure was pretty good. We woke up well, she woke up several times, and I woke up to her licking my face, which there are worse ways to be woken up to but she's, I think she's going to be okay. But anyway, talk about nerve racking. But at any rate, she's here and she's resting. My whole point is that it's finally a moment where she doesn't feel well and she's able to just lay down and she's actually napping. She's closing your eyes right now. So I can I can get some work done.

And I'm excited to bring you this guest I'm loving. I'm loving this theme. I hope that you are too. And I also, just a quick reminder that we have some openings for private coaching this fall. And if you are thinking about writing a book, if you've always thought, I need to write a book, I want to write a book. Everyone tells me I should write a book. And you have no idea where to start… I get that question a lot when I'm even when I'm being interviewed for like the topics of my book, people are like, how did you get it done? They want to know the process of how to write a book. I do work with people in a consulting relationship where I help you, even if you are totally stuck, we could just do like a one off strategy session, I can help you get clear on what it is. Or even help you decide if you want to write the book or not or which direction you want to go. If it's traditional publishing and we go hybrid or complete self-publishing. The question becomes what is your book? Not what is it about. That comes later, but what is your book? And that's what you have to and of course I asked more questions than that. Figuring out like what your book actually is. That's what you have to figure out first. So let me know you can either just shoot us an email support@AndreaOwen.com or you can fill out a coaching application AndreaOwen.com/coaching and we can see if it is a great fit.

All right, switching gears. If you don't know who our guest is today, I'm excited for you to meet her and you're gonna get to know her. Yasmine Cheyenne is a self-healing educator, author, speaker and mental wellness advocate who helps people learn how to cultivate daily practices to build healthy, joyful lives. Yasmin believes in self-healing for everyone, and with a launch of the Sugar Jar Community app, she's created a safe space to develop self-awareness, learn boundaries and find resources to support your mental health. Coming in January 2023, she will be releasing her first book, The Sugar Jar, and The Sugar Jar will show readers that through little adjustments to set boundaries and nurture our energy, we can create more balance and joy in our lives. So without further ado, here is Yasmin Cheyenne.

Yasmin, thank you so much for being here.

Yasmine  05:49
Thank you so much for having me.

Andrea  05:52
Yay. I was so excited. I told you as soon as we got on to Zoom, like, I can't wait to ask you all these questions because everything that you talked about is in so much alignment with what my audience loves, and loves to hear about and learn about and have experts on other than my big mouth saying the same thing over and over again. Sometimes it takes a different, a different, you know, different words different expert coming on. And so I don't know if I've ever had any one on who specifically uses the term self-healing. So let's start there. Like, why tell us why self-healing isn't such an important part of our self-care?

Yasmine  06:31
Yes, first of all, again, thank you for having me. And I think self-healing is important for our healing journey, for ourselves, our self-care, because we're not always in a place where we can afford outside therapy. We're not always in a place where we're willing to listen to what other people are saying. And I think also, more than that, for any of the external advice we're being given, whether it's our therapist, or coach, our spiritual teacher to work, we have to be willing to understand our internal voice. And so when we start with ourselves, and we start asking ourselves, those tough questions, when we start having those internal conversations, we're able to integrate all of the healing work we're doing in the outside world, within our lives. And until we get to know ourselves, we're not able to do that as well. And I think that's why self-healing is so important, whether you're doing it with other people, or whether you're doing it solo.

Andrea  07:24
Of course, it can go the other direction and sometimes be harmful. But I think for the most part, social media has been incredibly helpful for those people who might not be in a place where either they don't have the means to afford outside care, or they're just like, not really ready to go there. I mean, TikTok has been an excellent resource, I think, for so many in the mental health industry. And so speaking of like, you created community called The Sugar Jar Community. So, first of all, tell people what that is, and why or how did you start it?

Yasmine  07:58
Yeah, you know, I created The Sugar Jar Community app because the majority of one-on-one clients that I've worked with, have been people who have said, well, you know, healings not really for me, I just want to feel better. Or healings not really for me, I just want to do better at work, or healings not really for me, I just want to find a boyfriend. And I think that it's important to meet people where they are. Like, when you were saying earlier, TikTok’s been helpful. I know, Instagram has been very helpful for people. And before social media, we all know, some of us read self-help books. Like yeah, this is what we we've always been on this journey of self-excavation and I think now it's just become more relevant for people of all ages, and all backgrounds to feel comfortable saying, yes, I go to therapy, but like, what do you do the other 14 days before you go back to your therapist? Your with yourself. So this is something that just allows you, The Sugar Jar Community app allows you to continue to deep dives. And I find that when you are with a therapist or coach or spiritual healer, when you're doing that self-excavation, when you're not. In those sessions, when you come back to those sessions you have more to bring rather than when you know, if you're only getting that work in for that 50 minute period, most therapists only see for 50 minutes, not the full hour, you're not getting the full breadth of what you could be getting if you were on that journey with yourself as well.

Andrea  09:22
I always tell people, and I think that I might have heard this in coach training 15 years ago, somebody said, one of our instructors said the majority of the work happens in between the sessions. And it struck me because I remember thinking that when I was in couples therapy in my previous marriage and like being so frustrated that my vent….my previous husband, like wouldn't do any of the work and, and I was like, Do you think it's like a magic wand that we're just gonna like be in there for 45 minutes and like our life is gonna change. But I agree with you. I think it's it sounds super cliché but like you get out of it, what you put into it, and doesn't mean you have to, you know, have your nose to the grindstone every single, every single minute of every single day.  And I think that you've created something amazing by having people in community because there's really something magical about that.

Yasmine  10:15
Absolutely. And, you know, it was all of the things that we talked about with social media, for example, one of the brilliant things about it has been people recognizing that they're not alone in the way that they do suffer. There's going to be ups and downs in life, we're going to have those highs and lows. You know, we heal, so that we have the tools to be able to support us when tough things happen. Healing doesn't make life perfect. Guilt doesn't make everything, you know, work out the way we want it to, although I wish it did. It really just supplies us with what we need to be able to still have access to ease and peace and joy while the world sometimes feels like it's falling apart when you're going through those tough times.

Andrea  10:57
Right? Well, what that brings me to what I wanted to ask you like, what are some, like, we get a little bit granular here. Like, what are some strategies that someone can use to start their self-healing journey? Or do you think, you know, it might be more beneficial to… I feel like you're kind of like not attached to like, if somebody does it the self-healing way or there's more beneficial to have a therapist or coach, but what are some strategies that someone can use?

Yasmine  11:23
Yeah, absolutely. I think so to just to be clear, I'm definitely not attached. I think every individual finds the way that's best for them to start their healing journey or continue it. I always like to invite people to start with self-boundaries. And why do I call themselves boundaries? Because there are boundaries that only have to deal with you not boundaries that require you to sit down and have a conversation with your friend, or with your partner. Because when we think about boundaries, that if you don't know what boundaries are, the way I define them is the rules or like the regulation, that the rules that we put in place that dictate the way we interact with people, places and things. It's how we teach people how to treat us and vice versa. And when we start healing, and we start realizing, oh my gosh, I'm a people pleaser. Oh, wow, I over again, we start thinking, I'm going to tell every single person in my life, how I feel, and they are not going to have access to me anymore, because they take too much and they don't care about, you know, we want to shift…

Andrea  12:20
On a surface level I think that's how people think boundaries work.

Yasmine  12:25
Right. We think it's an ultimatum. We think this is what you need to do for me. And sometimes it is a clear set definition of, hey, don't wear shoes in my house. Hey, don't curse around my kids. You know, sometimes it is that that direct. ut self-boundaries start with you. Like, if you've decided that you want to wake up early in the morning, then you're the one that needs to set the alarm and actually get up. If you're the one who decided that you don't want to be on your phone after 830, then you need to put the Do Not Disturb on and stop answering the phone call. And it's not a goal. It's not a plan. It's more so saying this is the boundary I put in place, I'm done with my phone after this time. And the reason why self-boundaries are the great place to start is because they allow you to start bringing your own energy back. The energy and time that we give to people in places, and the story that we tell ourselves that everyone is taking from me. You know, when we think about the sugar jar, the reason why I use that metaphor is because, you know, we think that everyone is coming into our kitchen and taking our sugar, our energy, our time, our money. When really it's we don't have a lid on our job, we don't have the boundaries in place so people are just taking what they see. We're the ones that have to put the lid on the jar. We're the ones who have to say no to ourselves first and then honor and respect that No. From that place, we're more able to advocate for ourselves in a healthy way in our external relationships but the boundaries always start with us. The way that we interact with ourselves always starts with us.

Andrea  13:57
Yes. I believe that. Well, let's talk about stay on the topic of boundaries here for just a minute. And I'm curious what your thoughts are around creating boundaries with other people and if you want to get into like what that might actually look like, like with like an example like, you know, a hypothetical example of that would be great. But, but what I'm really curious about is how can that help someone heal? Because we I tend to talk about boundaries from a place of like, this needs to happen in order for you to, you know, feel good about yourself, have a better life and stop taking people's crap. But can you talk about it from a place of actual healing for something that someone might experience?

Yasmine  14:42
Absolutely. I would love to talk about people pleasers. Because I think that in a way all of us have a part of us that is willing to overgive in relationships where we feel like this is what I should be doing, quote unquote. This is how I should show up with this person. I'm a sister, I'm a mom, I'd rather, I should do this. And the reason that boundaries help us begin to heal is because when we begin to put down…to get to the boundary… Thank you for asking this because to get to the boundary, we often have to be honest with ourselves about why the boundaries needed. So we're thinking about, I want to turn my phone off at 830 because I don't have time to do the things that I enjoy doing after a long day, then the question might be, why do I need to put a boundary in place? Well, because I don't have time because people are always calling me, right? So if we're honest with ourselves, then that's what that process looks like. I don't have time because people keep calling me after 830 so I need to put a boundary in place so that I have the space.

If we're not honest with ourselves, and the conversation might start sound more like, like we talked about earlier, they're taking from me, I'm always over giving, I'm always the one that has to be on the call, I'm always the one that has to help pick up the kids, I'm always the one that has to do this. We're more likely to feel those feelings of resentment, especially for not being honest with ourselves or with them, we're more likely to hold on to and harp negative emotions about what's happening around us rather than make the actual changes that can give us access to what we do the healing for.

The reason that we embrace healing, or that we go on a healing journey, I hope for most of us, so that we can enjoy our lives more. Not so that we can just heal, you know, forever, we're doing it because we want to have more spaciousness, or we want to have more freedom, or we don't want to carry burdens, or we're doing it because of trauma, we may have experience, right. And we want to release ourselves from those feelings, from those experiences, or to at least create a space of acceptance about what we experienced and make room for something different as we move forward.

And so boundaries helps us to create space in our lives. If we don't have boundaries, then most likely, we are completely overwhelmed and we as an individual are under prioritize in our own lives. And so boundaries is often that starting point, specifically with ourselves. Just asking like the blunt question, what do I do every single day that I don't actually want to be doing? Where am I saying yes? Why am I going to that event? Why am I watching her dog this weekend? I don't like dogs.  You know, like, what are the things that I say yes to, and then hold resentment within myself and then feel angry within myself, or wish someone would reciprocate for me that they never do. What am I doing in my life in the hopes that eventually it'll feel good, or someone will see what I do for them and reciprocate it or me.

Andrea  17:44
You're singing the codependency theme song here.

Yasmin  17:50
I am.

Andrea  17:53
Well, you know what word kept popping up as you were describing all of that stuff, I was like, it's the resentment for me. If I'm feeling resentful, I know that there's a conversation that needs to take place, and probably a boundary. Not every time because I mean, I'm not, I'm not gonna sit here and tell everybody that every time I feel resentment, there's something that someone else is doing that their behavior needs to change. Sometimes it's mine. Sometimes it's my perspective, sometimes it's my expectations need to change and it's very nuanced, I feel like depending on the situation, depending on the person. But I think the vast majority of the time when I'm feeling resentful, there's a boundary that I have not either been clear on, or I have not had the conversation in the first place where I have not been holding that other person accountable for that boundary.

And I was just having a conversation with someone else here on my show, talking about my own personal experience and in self-abandoning and for me, one thing I've realized after decades, which are my own work is that when I set a boundary, and I stick to it, I'm proving to myself, that I matter. Like, I mattered to me. Like, what I what I need, what I want, what I can tolerate matters. And if someone else is negligent and reckless with that, then that's a humongous red flag. One that I have ignored a million times.

Yasmine  19:18
And that's the key word there. Like that's why we start with ourselves, because sometimes we haven't shared it sometimes we that we haven't shared the boundary and so that's why, you know, the check in with ourselves is like, oh, I'm resentful because they're doing this thing but actually, I never told them, they couldn't do this thing, right? But sometimes we have shared it and we're the ones who are ignoring it. And so that's checking again, it's gonna happen with us. Like, we're not gonna go to them and say, Hey, I've been ignoring this boundary thing you've been doing, we're gonna say, we're going to talk to ourselves and say, I've been ignoring this boundary and this is what I need to do. And I think that's why starting with ourselves is so powerful. We eliminate so many of the conversations, projections, debates because people will try to debate us about what we need or what we believe when we go to ourselves and say, actually, this is what I need. Because sometimes we need a conversation. And sometimes it's just like, I'm not picking up the phone.

Andrea  20:15
Right. Yes, I've had, I've had that where you just vote anymore. But I've done it the wrong way to where I've just not had the conversation. I'm just like, ignoring it, like pretending it'll just go away. I had a client once that said, I guess people are going to keep crossing my boundaries if I never told them about the boundaries in the first place. She wasn't trying to be funny, you know, like, and it was funny. It was such a moment of realization for her that she had to learn about. And I think too, so many arguments happen. And repeated arguments happen because there's a boundary that's like, never been talked about.

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What advice would you give to a client who tends to be a chronic people pleaser and they say I really I know I need to have this conversation with someone, but I'm terrified to do it.

Yasmine  22:30
I'll give them two different options to decide for themselves. The first question I would ask is, Is this person a safe person to have this conversation with? I think this is super important because not every person has done the work or has the capacity or capability to hear what we have to share.

Andrea  22:48
Yeah. And can we back up even a step further? How do you define safe person?

Yasmine  22:52
Yeah, so let's say it's a family member, because these are often the hardest one. So people say, Well, it's my mom. And you know, but I don't feel comfortable having this conversation with her because she's passive aggressive, or whatever, maybe full-on aggressive. Thinking about the behavior of this person, that this person makes you feel safe and normal conversation? Do you feel anxiety before you have to meet with them? Are they aggressive with you? Do they take self-accountability? Are they willing to hear you out? You know, asking yourself does this person…this is not from a place of judgment. This is like, from a place of honesty. Has this person shown me in the past that they're going to be able to hear what I'm going through and hear what I need from them and are we going to be able to have a healthy conversation to get to a place of compromise and understanding or is this going to be a conversation that leads to a fight, you know, argument denying your experience, gaslighting you know things like that.

And this is not an opportunity to diagnose people or anything like that. It's more so just recognizing the experience that you've had with this person and being honest, because if they're not a safe person, and a safe person would be someone, not someone who's perfect, this person may still get upset, this person may still get frustrated with what you have to say, but they're willing to listen to you. They're not going to necessarily talk over you the whole time. They're not going to call you names or say that you're a liar because you said you need boundaries. They're willing to respect you during this conversation. Like if it's someone who's safe, then yes, you may be willing to have a conversation with them.

And the reason why this is important is because sometimes we set ourselves up for even more negative interactions with the person thinking that we're going to be clearing the air. And sometimes even unconsciously, we're hoping that maybe this time things will be different. It's so important to trust what people are showing you. You know what Dr. Maya Angelou always says you know when people show you who they are believe them. And this is also part of self-healing and respecting ourselves and boundaries is respecting our own boundaries. If I said, I don't want to have these kinds of interactions, then why do I keep walking into them?

Andrea  25:10
Okay, yeah. So okay, I have more questions about that but I want to, I want to finish sort of this like kind of chunk of advice. So if someone is not a safe person, what do they do next?

Yasmine  25:24
So someone's not a safe person to have a conversation with then that's where self-healing really becomes important. And when I say self-healing, I just want to be clear that I'm not saying it has to happen alone. Self-healing is something that we do with ourselves, yes, but then you can take the work that you're doing to your therapist, to your coach, even to your friends, your family, people that, again, you feel safe with. Have those tough conversations with friends and family say, hey, you know, I'm having this problem with my sister or my mom and this is what I'm working through and I just need someone to talk to you about it, bring it to your therapist, bring it to your coach, and begin to discern, is this a relationship that I can continue to be in without resolving this issue? Do I feel safe in this relationship? Am I going to be able to move on from this particular situation and just accept that this is a thing, their passive aggressiveness, their inability to respect my boundaries. Am I going to be able to deal with these behaviors and continue to be in relationship with them? Because let's face it, many of us are in relationships with family members that aren't necessarily the healthiest folks to be and we're doing it because their family, right, and we are, we don't want to end the relationship, or the, the alternative is, this person isn't safe, and I'm not going to continue the relationship. And of course, there's a gray within that. You know, we might have, I go to events, and I and I'll be around them when there are other people there, but I won't do one on one here. You begin to have that conversation about what the relationship is going to look like and how you feel safe as being in their presence,

Andrea  27:00
Right. Sometimes a boundary looks like you only have surface level conversations with that person at obligatory family functions.

Yasmine  27:08
The big work is not the reason again, to do the self-healing work is that you don't feel guilty about this choice, you learn that you're actually making a healthy choice for yourself. And sometimes we have to prioritize what we need, or what other people are telling us we should need or what we should be doing.

Andrea  27:25
Yeah, thank you for bringing up the family member thing, because what I hear over and over again, and I'm sure you do too, with your clients is how painful it is for people to set these kinds of boundaries with their family members and feeling like a bad sibling, or child or whatever it is to the relation to your family member. And I was asked recently, in one of my groups, by a woman saying, you know, what do I do if I have repeatedly tried to set this kind of boundary with a family member, and it was her mother and, and they just refuse to acknowledge it. And I said, I think that we vastly underestimate how much grief is involved when we try to set a boundary with someone especially when it's a parent, and they don't respect it because in many cases, if not most cases, it's less painful to hold out hope that they're going to change and they're going to see it our way and they're going to respect our boundary, rather than accept that they likely won't and to go through the grieving process, that they're not going to be the type of parent that we want them to be.

Yasmine  28:43
Oh my gosh, yes.

Andrea  28:44
I remember when I heard that. That was largely what I learned from I'm trained and certified in Brené Brown's work. And in the Rising Strong curriculum, she talks about giving people the benefit of that they are doing the best they can with what they have. Like they're doing their best all the time and many times their best is crap. And that's when we need to set boundaries. And then later, she talks about grief and I put it together and I'm like, this is everything that I also do with families because I should have held out hope that somebody was going to change and been disappointed over and over and over again. And I don't I don't want to say people don't change. They do. I have received apologies from someone in my life before who was a lot older than me and like I was kind of convinced I'm like, this person is never gonna change and then they apologize. So I was taken aback. But I do think that that's the exception in many cases, and that my experience isn't a super common one. And I just want to emphasize that grief is such a big part of boundaries a lot of times because we don't get what we want.

Yasmine  29:52
Absolutely. And someone commented on one of my posts one time, like the pain of grieving the living because we do when we talk about grief, when we think about grief, a lot with loss or with death. But it's the death of a relationship. You know, when you put a boundary in place, you're saying that the way that we were doing this relationship, this current cycle is done, we're moving on, I'm moving on to something different. And so you do have that grief.

And, you know, that's why I talked about the words self-healing, you know, dealing with the guilt that comes up this is these are normal things that come up with any kind of grief, you know, you could have done something different. Is it me, you know, we start questioning ourselves and that's why it's so important to yes, if you're self-healing, but have community have friends, have your coach or therapist, people who can support you while you're going through this process because, yes, you're going to do a lot of the work alone in your journal, you know, in an app, through books, but you also want to be able to have those conversations so that people can reflect and mirror to you your strength, and also be there to support you compassionately while you're making these tough choices.

Andrea  30:57
Thank you for all of that. And I want to kind of slightly switch gears, because I know you talk about a lot of different things in our healing journey and just like being self-aware, and one of the things that I loved I was looking at your Instagram feed is you were talking about the…it was it sounded like it was kind of a strategy of you know, people always, we tend to have that negativity bias as humans do. And thinking about like worst case scenarios, especially the anxiety women out there listening, like I see you. I am one. And just oh my gosh, like what if this happens, and what if that happens? And you were talking about learning the strategy of, of, you know, there are other truths and like, what if something amazing happened? Like it's a possibility.

I had a coach once that call that the it's kind of a mouthful, the what if up game. So like, you know, what if the technology fails on this recording, and I lose the whole thing, and then I have to look like kind of a jerk and tell Yasmin, like, ask her if we could do it again. Like, you know, that could happen. Or what if it's an amazing thing, and like, she gets all this work from it and then we end up collaborating together. Like I don't I'm not putting pressure on. Like learning that perspective, just training our brains like… Is that how you look at it? It's kind of like mind training, that there are other truths, rather than like what our brain says.

Yasmine  32:18
Yes. And I think that we have to, you know, I think it's so important that we learn to trust that things are not always going to go the way we hoped. That is one of the things that I try to impart with myself, but especially with my clients, and in my work, because when we think that things have to go the way that we hoped a lot of times, and I'm a recovering perfectionist myself, but perfection gets in the way of us, reminding ourselves about our humanness and we think that we lose sight of the fact that we actually don't have as much control as we think we do, on how things turn out. But we can definitely control how we react to how things turn out.

And I think it just gives us that… Again, I always go back to compassion, because that's the thing that I think most of us are lacking the way that we talk to ourselves. It's an opportunity, we might be like, shit, I can't believe this happen and get really hard on ourselves in that moment. And then we can come back and say, okay, this is how I can give myself compassion in this moment and recognize that when I couldn't have controlled this, to this is how I can react to this. This is who I can ask for help. This is how I can, you know, adjust to the situation. And I also love to think about every error or mistake is actually a lesson or a blessing rather than, oh, this is like, you know, I made this mistake. I'm wrong. This is wrong. I made the wrong choice. Every time I've made a mistake, even the ones that I'm like, gosh, I wish I really didn't have to learn this lesson. In hindsight, I'm still like, okay, what came from that? And I'm not talking about like, the really tough things that we sometimes go through that just suck. And because I'm not the type of person, it's like, everything that happens in life was meant to go through sometimes life just sucks.

Andrea  34:08
Thank you. I say something like, sometimes life is the worst. And things just happen.

Yasmine  34:17
Yeah, there's those moments. And then there's like, I chose this job because I thought it would be a better job, it turned out that it wasn't, and yet, I was able to get another job after this, I learned a lesson, and now I'm moving on. Like, there's those kinds of situations where we don't have to hold ourselves hostage for potentially making a quote unquote, wrong mistake. I can compassionately hold myself and recognize that I thought I was making a good decision.

Andrea  34:41
You didn't manifest it. It's okay. Yes. Oh my gosh. I was so glad we're on the same page about a lot of those things. What is the most common or like one of the most common strategies that you teach people for a problem that you see over and over again with your clients, or maybe like, what's your favorite?

Yasmine  35:02
My favorite is the friendships that we have that actually suck.

Andrea  35:09
Like, okay, okay, say more about that.

Yasmine  35:11
The issue that I think I deal with the most is people recognizing once they start this work that the relationships, specifically friendships, or romantic relationships, but we'll just do friendships for this one that aren't actually reciprocal. Like this is a one sided relationship, I'm actually the one that's always there for them, they, you know, never show up for me, I don't feel seen with them, I actually don't need to feel safe with this person. And I see the client or in the workshop, I see the person recognizing this, I have to walk away from this. Like this isn't working. And I think the thing that I always remind people when this happens, because it's for sure happened to me, I'm sure it's happened to a lot of the folks listening. And this is gonna sound super cliche, but like, remembering that the people that you meet are seasonal is so powerful. Not every single person that you meet has to be your best friend, not every single employee, right? Not every single acquaintance you make has to be someone that you now have to bring into prince status. Not everybody needs to meet your parents, not everybody needs to know where you live. Like reminding yourself that there's different buckets of friendships. Like this people that I know and love and that I'm extremely close to I've known for years, and then there's people that I'm friendly with, and they stay in that friendly bucket and may hang out and I really might care about them. And yet, they don't have to be…

And so I'm saying this to say that our friendships don't have to necessarily end just because we realize that they're not working with the way that we are. Now I want you to begin to get curious about am I looking at this person, as the type of friend that maybe they don't see me as and I need to put them in a different bucket. We can maybe still be connected, but they're not going to be someone that, you know, I'm giving all of this work to, giving all this emotional support to, or giving all this work to or showing up for in this way, when actually we're in a different, we're in a different page. I'm saying that because most people are afraid to end these relationships, or most people are afraid that they'll end up alone, if they actually required all of their relationships to meet certain standards of showing up and being seen or being understood. And really, it's about recognizing that friendships are on a spectrum. They don't, all have to be, that every single person you're in relationship has to meet these particular requirements in order to be your friend. Or most likely, you would have a hard time keeping people in your life. Figure out what you need to feel safe.

And this also doesn't have to be something you have a conversation with every person about. I mean, I know like I'm might be sounding like I'm telling people over and over again, the same thing, but like truly the things that we go to people with a lot of times to have a conversation about the conversation needs to happen with ourselves. Am I happy with them as a friend before I go talk to this person? Am I happy with them? Do I trust them? Do I feel safe with them? Would I feel better if they were someone I just saw sometimes it's just the one I kept getting upset about because they don't have time to see me as often as I want? Do I need more single friends now that I'm single? Do I need more mom friends now that I'm a parent? You know, whatever it is that you need, begin asking yourself those questions, and then look at how you can make that a possibility in your life. Because it's true, it is hard to maintain friendships as we get older and it's especially harder to find new friends as we get older as well.

Andrea  38:26
I love that so much. And it made me think of a particular friendship that I have where I tend to, you know, my life motto for a long time has been like, just run as fast as you can around corners with your arms open, but your eyes closed. Like it gets me and so much trouble. I have one particular friend whom I adore and this person, I realized she was kind of gossiping about our other friends and I was like I don't I don't like that and I don't participate in that. I didn't say that, you know is what I'm thinking. And I'm like, okay, well, if she's doing that to other people, she's likely doing that about me too. So I still am friends with her. And I just don't tell her my deepest, darkest secrets. Like I just, were a little bit more on the surface now and she did not push back when like I initiated that in our friendship and I was like, she might think the same thing about me like I might have irritated her. It's very…it feels very mutual.

I have found that friendships are so much like romantic relationships in that you will get your heart broken, and you're asked emotionally from time to time in these friendships and it is just kind of the way it works. And please, please do the work to keep putting yourself out there and find new friendships. And here's the question I often get is like, I have a hard time finding other people friendships that are interested also in personal development and I tell people, start a book club. You know? Get your get your sugar jar book or whatever. To start a book club and people who are interested and in the same types of things are I've heard, I've heard actually good things about Bumble BFF. Have you heard about that one?

Yasmine  40:08
I have. And I have heard good things about that. I've heard a story, and article too where a woman who met her maid of honor on Bumble BFF.

Andrea  40:16
I've had women come to my in-person retreats, who have been lifelong friends. And even I don't teach them anymore, but when I used to do online groups, kind of like yours. I've had people who had never met in person, and they just really hit it off in the group and then they ended up meeting in person and are still friends after all these years so…

Yasmine  40:35
I love that. And I think it's so important to because your friends are not going to always go on the same journey you're going on. And don't leave your friendship just because they don't care about what you're interested in. Now find that folks? Yeah, right.

Andrea  40:46
Yeah, I mean, I still have good friends who kind of know what I do for a living and they're like, that's interesting. But you know, we bond over our children being the same age and things like that. So it's, it's definitely important to have.

I have loved this conversation so much. I appreciate you to the moon and back and everyone the book is The Sugar Jar: Create Boundaries, Embrace Self-Healing, and Enjoy the Sweet Things In Life available December 27?

Yasmine  41:14
Yes, but it's available for preorder now.

Andrea  41:17
Yay. It's available for pre order now, is there any kind of like, are you doing any like special, like, are giving away candy if people buy the book earlier or things like that?

Yasmine  41:25
Like, better than candy. No. So if you go to YasminCheyenne.com/books, and you preorder, there's instructions on the site, but you'll get a four part course to help you start creating boundaries and bracing self-healing right now as you wait for your book to arrive by December. Amazing.

Andrea  41:42
Well, thank you again, so much for being here. I've just so enjoyed this. And thank you, listeners for being here and for spending your time with us today. And remember, it's our life's journey to make ourselves better humans and our life's responsibility to make the world a better place. Bye for now.

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