PODCAST & BLOG

PODCAST & BLOG

Sex educator and pleasure coach Whitni Miller joins me for a conversation about intimacy, relationships, and sex. When I decided to create a theme around women’s health, Whitni was one of the several guests I was hoping would say yes to being a guest. And, she did! Whitni focuses on maximizing female pleasure through self-work and relational communication, which you’ll hear about in this episode. 

We also discuss: 

  • The biggest reason heterosexual couples stop having sex (5:33)
  • Where to start if you and your partner know you’re having intimacy issues (10:17)
  • Top 3 reasons why women lose their sexual desire and what women can do to increase their sex drive (14:55)
  • How arousal works and can it really be turned on and off like a lightswitch? (27:42)
  • Some ways couples can make sex more playful (32:43)
  • Breath work and its impact on sexual pleasure (35:18)

If you missed the announcement, an updated and revised edition of my book How to Stop Feeling Like Shit is coming in December! 🎉  We have some amazing bonuses and giveaways planned, so head over HERE to pre-order and grab those!

Resources:
Whitni on TikTok
Magnificent Sex, Peggy Kleinplatz, A. Ménard

Book recommendations:
You know how I love a good personal development book, right? I’ve compiled a list of book recommendations, as mentioned in past episodes. Check out these amazing book recommendations here. Happy reading!

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Find a complete list of our sponsors and their offerings visit andreaowen.com/sponsors. Thank you for your support!

Whitni is a sex educator and pleasure coach with a focus on maximizing female pleasure through self-work and relational communication. She combines her yoga philosophy (7yrs) background with her knowledge of sexual health and relationship science to help people attain their pleasure goals.

Right-click to download the episode.mp3

 


SHOW TRANSCRIPT 

Whitni  00:00
Communication is a lubrication so if there's something going on with sex, whether it's like the way that you initiate the unresolved conflict, even if it's you personally just having body image issues. Like talk about these things, because that's true intimacy. Intimacy is not rubbing your skin together, it's in-to-me-see, so let your partner see inside of you and share your interior world.

Andrea  00:26
You're listening to Make Some Noise Podcast episode number 491 with guest Whitni Miller.

Welcome to Make Some Noise Podcast, your guide for strategies, tools and insight to empower yourself. I'm your host, Andrea Owen, global speaker, entrepreneur, life coach since 2007, and author of three books that have been translated into 18 languages and are available in 22 countries. Each week, I'll bring you a guest or a lesson that will help you maximize unshakable confidence, master resilience and make some noise in your life. Are you ready? Let's go.

Hey, everyone, welcome to another episode of the podcast. I'm so glad you're here. If you missed it, big announcement last week, How To Stop Feeling Like Shit is being rereleased because it's been updated. I'm so happy to have had the opportunity to do this. As I've mentioned, some big things have happened since I wrote it in 2016. It came out in 2018, but over the last half decade, yeah, a lot of things have happened and I was thinking about I'm like, I wish I could go back and update it, I would add this I would add this this is so important to mention and voila. Here we are. Coming out on December 27 is going to ship, and there are bonuses that go with this new revised updated version. Same cover, same fun confetti, but it's a yellow cover instead of a white one. So if you have never read the book or listen to it on audio, now's a perfect chance because it's been updated. And if you have, I do think it's worth getting another copy to grab these updates. Every single chapter has updates, and it's easy to understand the updates because they're not woven in. It's at the very end of the chapter. I'm like, okay, whole new perspective or brand-new tools. Here are some new tips for you. It's fairly obvious where the revisions slash updates are. So the bonuses, there's a secret podcast series, there is a workbook that goes along with the book, we're doing a giveaway, we're doing a sharing giveaway, where I'm giving away a one on one session with me my favorite candles from Zipora Scents, and Malicious Woman Company, notebooks. Just head on over to Andrea one.com/HTSFLS as always, that link will be in the show notes. And everything will be there. I so appreciate your support with this book that been has been on quite the journey been translated into 19 languages and available in 23 countries. I'm still amazed at that fact. And I just appreciate you so much.

Alright. Today's guest I have been following her on the social medias. The socials. Is that what they call it? The socials? And I love her posts, so informative, about intimacy, about relationships about sex, mostly. And we get into the nitty gritty. I really think that you're going to love this conversation. I asked some pretty important questions, as you will hear. And let me tell you a little bit about our guest today in case you do not know her. Whitni Miller is a sex educator and pleasure coach with a focus on maximizing female pleasure through self-work and relational communication. She combines her yoga philosophy background with her knowledge of sexual health and relationship science to help people attain their pleasure goals. So without further ado, here is Whitni.

Whitni, thank you so much for being here.

Whitni  04:25
Thank you for having me.

Andrea  04:27
You were a, I'll confess now that we've we started recording, that you were one of the people when I asked my team to reach out to you I was like, oh my God, I hope she says yes.

Whitni  04:38
I was excited can be a part of it.

Andrea  04:40
Oh, I'm so glad that you're also excited to be here because I've watched your social media, you know, just your little kind of quickie the ABCs, 123’s if you will, about intimacy and sex and so many different topics that you cover. And I love that it's research based, and I'm just really glad to have you here as we delve a little bit further into women's health. And as I was telling you before, before we started recording, I do think in 2023 we’re going to specifically have a sex theme so I would love to have you come back on. We're gonna have a part two. I already know it.

Let's start with, you know, I am going to kind of bounce around a little bit because there's so many different things that I want to ask you. But in the work that you've done and the research that you've done, what do you see is the biggest reason why heterosexual couples stop having sex in their long term relationships?

Whitni  05:33
Okay, so the biggest thing that I see is resentment. Unspoken conversations. Like, both people are just hanging on to something in an effort to manage the other person's emotions. But what happens is, they don't, it's usually one or the other doesn't want to have sex with the other person, because they're like, I'm mad at you but I'm not talking about why I'm mad at you because I don't want you to be mad at me. It’s hard to manage someone else's emotions by holding back a conversation.

Andrea  06:03
I will say before you go any further, all kidding aside, one of the best marriage counselors that we've ever had and it's actually still the person that we see is the one who gently encouraged us, and it was not easy, to have the conversations that we both were too afraid to have.

Whitni  06:21
Absolutely.

Andrea  06:23
It was intense. And it was uncomfortable. But it was the best thing ever for our relationship.

Whitni  06:28
Like how did it feel afterwards?

Andrea  06:28
Like I was gonna throw up. There were several sessions. One time I asked him, I might actually have him on. I asked him has anyone ever thrown up in your office? And he said, no, but I have had people storm out because these are such uncomfortable conversations and I'm like, I get that. Luckily, neither me or my husband stormed out, and nobody threw up, but I sure wanted to.

So anyway, please continue.

Whitni  06:50
Gosh, I mean, I just had one of these conversations with my partner last weekend, that she's talking about my phone addiction. She's like, oh, you know, you're on your phone too much because I work on my phone. And I took accountability for that and it was uncomfortable and I cried and disappointed in myself. But after that conversation, I don't think I've ever felt that close to someone because she looked at me in my weak, ugly places, and was like, I still love you and I think you can do better.

Andrea  07:15
So are you saying part of the remedy of that is for to have the uncomfortable conversation and then for the person to take responsibility and accountability for their behavior or actions.

Whitni  07:26
Yeah, absolutely. You know, because there's that opportunity to nourish the connection between you by being accountable for the things that that are, you know, your responsibility. Obviously, you don't want to start managing each other's emotions, but be accountable for the space that you take up in the relationship.

Andrea  07:42
Can you be more specific about some of the topics that like you said, that they're one person's mad at the other person for something or the other something unspoken. What are what are some of the specifics that you hear?

Whitni  07:55
Just yesterday, I had a client who was talking about feeling unseen in the relationship. And that seems to be a theme that comes up a lot like I feel unseen, I feel unheard I tell my partner, hey, you know, when you leave your socks in the floor, it makes me feel like you don't appreciate the work that I do do in the house. And the socks keep getting left on the floor, you know, and there's just this like, life happens. And sometimes relationships, they get put in the backseat as life is happening but at some point, they need to be prioritized. So if your partner is coming to you and saying, hey, this thing right here, it hurts my feelings when you do it. Like that needs to be addressed. It's not something that needs to be pushed to the side and then expecting someone to have sex with you when you don't address those things, or make them feel unheard is like, it's just a natural thing for somebody not to want to have sex with you when you make them feel invisible.

Andrea  08:46
Yeah, I was watching one of your TikTok videos and you were talking about which I want to get to you were talking about arousal and you said something like, this advice isn't going to work if you're having issues in your relationship, you might have even said that like where you are feeling unseen, or…because learning how to become more aroused or arouse your partner is not the remedy for that. Those are two separate issues it sounds like.

Whitni  09:13
Absolutely. Well, it's gonna block the arousal from even getting started if there's unresolved conflict. So if you know that there's conflict in the relationship that's been unresolved, you're not going to fix it by having sex. Like some people think you do that, oh, we'll just you know, we'll sex the problem away. And it's like, absolutely, you will not.

Andrea  09:32
So it sounds like it's not an either or it's a both problem like both things need to be discussed and practiced and…

Whitni  09:39
At the end of the day, communication is lubrication and…

Andrea  09:43
I love that. You can just sell merch with that on it.

Whitni  09:46
It's not mine. It belongs with Dr. Kelly Caspersen. But yeah, absolutely. Communication is a lubrication. So if there's something going on with sex, whether it's like the way that you initiate the unresolve conflict, even if it's you personally just having body image issues like talk about these things, because that's true intimacy. Intimacy is not rubbing your skin together, it's in-to-me-see. So let your partner see inside of you and share your interior world.

Andrea  10:17
Got it. Okay. Where would I mean, obviously, you and I would probably both recommend some kind of counseling for couples that are experiencing intimacy issues, but let's say someone even wants to broach a topic about either their sex life or the socks on the floor, and they're nervous to have the conversation, where do you have like a, like a kind of script that you give your clients or I guess, a jumping off point?

Whitni  10:45
Do you mean like mediating between couples are having a hard time communicating to each other?

Andrea  10:49
Yeah, like maybe like one partner feels like they want to have this conversation and that, like you said, they're feeling resentful, and they are nervous to have it because they don't know how the other person is going to react so they just let it slide for months and months or years.

Whitni  11:03
Oh, my gosh, yeah cuz it makes our self-worth come up. When we talk about things that matter to us. You know, that feeling? Because we want to be validated. Yeah, absolutely. We want somebody to give us permission to feel what we're feeling, but it's not coming. I do have couples that I meet with, like I do one on ones but I also do like mediation between couples helping with relational communication. It's hard to have a script, though, because everybody's so individual and like the subjective experience, I really honor that. So having a script, I would have to feel the environment and see what's going on between the couples before I was like, okay, well, this is what he's saying and this is what he's feeling. Do you see that? And this is what she's saying and this is what she's feeling. Do you see that? And that's how that would go.

Andrea  11:51
The thing I tell people to is try to find a therapist or counselor, who you know, is going to really hear both of you. Because what happens, and especially I would guess in heterosexual relationships, the man comes in walks in thinking like he's going to be ganged up on. And like, to like, this is like, oh, I can't wait to go somewhere where, like, this professional and my partner are going to tell me all the things I'm doing wrong, I certainly wouldn't want to go.

Whitni  12:23
No, of course not that that's my thing. I like to take a non-judgmental, shame-free stance and allow everybody just to be themselves, but then find out what the goal is between the partners, and then find where the goal meets for both of them. So like, they may have different goals, but showing where that aligns for them. But I mean, a big deal there is is that like, your general therapists are going to have nine hours or less of sex education. So if the issue is intimacy, you really want to find a counselor, a coach, a therapist, who is sex specific.

Andrea  12:55
And that's what we did. It was months before we even talked about sex, to be honest with you.

Whitni  13:01
Oh, my gosh, I'm so glad that you bring that up because did you feel like that that was a good start to start with the other stuff first?

Andrea  13:09
Yeah. And you know, honestly, like, why I picked him, you know, obviously, like, I gave all these options to my husband, and I'm like, hey, here's the people. What do you think about these people? And I'm like, okay, here's what I like about this person's bio, and that person's bio. I was the one who I knew I needed to go in and talk about my sex stuff. Like I didn't even know if my husband was like, I didn't think that he and he was definitely, that was not one of his priorities. I was the one that brought in the SEC stuff. Because just anecdotally, he is the first person I've been with, I got sober just a couple years into our relationship and we are parents. So he's the first long term partner I've had where I have been a mother, and I've been a sober person. And so it kind of flipped me upside down and I'm like, I don't know, who I am sexually as this new identity. And then the years go on, and then just anyway… It was all my stuff. It was all my stuff. And so I told him that and I'm like, this is why I think we should see this person because he has a PhD and she's an actual sex therapist. But I thought it was interesting how we didn't even talk about sex for so long, because it was other stuff. And to be honest, I wasn't ready. I really have to trust that other person, the therapist before I can start like revealing my deepest, darkest sexual secrets.

Whitni  14:31
Absolutely, absolutely. Such a vulnerable place. And that's the role that I take with a lot of my clients, they'll come and they'll think because I'm a sex a pleasure coach they're like, oh, we're going to talk about sex and usually not we're going to talk about your relationship with your mom, your day to day activities. Like all of these little pieces come together and dictate whether or not you feel comfortable interacting with sex.

Andrea  14:55
100%. I would attest to that as a as a client.

Well, I want to shift gears slightly? And can you tell us what are the top, I don't know, like one to three reasons why women specifically lose their sexual desire and is there anything that women it's kind of a whopper of a question, is there anything that women can do to increase that?

Whitni  15:17
Yeah, so there's, gosh, there's about like, top three reasons that women lose sexual desire. Number one being pain with sex. Obviously, if you're feeling pain, you're not going to have a desire for it. Humans are dopamine seekers. So if you're not getting pleasure dopamine from it, you're not going to want to desire it, that's very natural. Number two would be unresolved conflict, like we talked about. And number three is boredom. Like, if the sex is boring and routine, again, you're not going to have desire for it. It's like, if you like ice cream, do you like it melted, because it doesn't matter how much you like ice cream, you're probably not going to desire melted ice cream. So if sex is like pizza every night, like it's just centered around penetration only and it's never like shaking it up, being curious, trying something new, or maybe you don't like your partner's initiation style, you'll naturally lose desire for it, nothing's broken, nothing's wrong with you. That's a conversation that needs to be had.

Andrea  16:19
One of the things that was tricky for me was that and this took a lot of unpacking, like over the years, and I didn't realize why I was having such a hard time because… I have no problem telling people what I want. I just have always been that way. I'm very outspoken. I'm an eight on the Enneagram I'm an Aries. Just, no problem with that. But I was noticing that was happening with intimacy and I'm like, what the fuck is going on? Like, this isn't really who I am. And I did a timeline kind of an inventory as my previous therapist called it, of all of the partners that I'd ever had. And she was like, you know, kind of walk me through you know, do it on your own first like journal about like, what was the experience like and so this was a pattern. Like I was I am not as like outspoken. Well, this is interesting. So what it boiled down to for me was the socialization and programming that I had received, you know, growing up in a fairly a fairly conservative Lutheran family, and that's what it really came down to. And then just years of just not talking about it just complacency and, and all that good stuff. So I'm assuming that's a pretty typical…

Whitni  17:35
So you would say that like shame and like kind of purity culture had kind of…

Andrea  17:39
Yeah, had seeped in. And I think because like, here I am as a different identity as a mother, that also added an extra layer. Because previously it wasn't it wasn't as bad with like previous partners when I wasn't a mom and like, all I had to really worry about was myself, it was a different experience.

Whitni  17:57
So you feel like becoming a mother also put, like, some dampening on that?

Andrea  18:02
Yeah, just like, you know, the insecurity and the voice of like, is that really like how mothers should behave? And which is…

Whitni  18:11
Oh, no, you take your mother hat with you into sexy time. I have a nine-year-old son. So like I told you, man, like I breastfed for three and a half years. So…

Andrea  18:22
…my second for two and a half years.

Whitni  18:25
Yes, it's a huge thing. And they don't tell you when you're leaving the hospital, hey, if you're breastfeeding, your dopamine levels are going to be low, your prolactin is going to be high, you're going to have a low desire for sex naturally. Thing about prolactin is it's it takes the place of dopamine in your body. So as soon as prolactin comes in the dopamine leaves, they can't be in the same place at the same time. So it lowers those levels and if you have lower levels of dopamine, you naturally will have lower desire for sex, try new things, leave the house…Like dopamine is what helps us want to push into things.

Andrea  18:57
Interesting.

Whitni  18:59
I wish they would tell mothers that when they leave the hospital because they go home thinking that they're broken after they have these children like I used to want sex, you know, and there's just no side note, hey, if you're nursing, you just naturally won't want to.

Andrea  19:15
Right which can cause like resentment issues with their partner if their partner wants to and they're being rejected.

Whitni  19:21
So the high desire partner always wants to fix the low desire partner. The low desire partner is always made to seem like they're broken and they're not. They're not. And I hate that.

Andrea  19:31
We'll talk more about that because I'm sure there's people listening who are feeling that way whose ears are perking up right now and what do you… have the floor, have at it. What do you like to tell those people?

Whitni  19:43
Sure. The first thing that I like to address about low desire is that low desire is not a description for your comparison to your partner. Like if you have a partner who has a higher rate of desire, then you are not a low desire by proxy. Low desire is a description for someone who used to have more desire, and now they're experiencing less and they are bothered by that. And not bothered by it because their partner is heckling them for more sex, but they genuinely would like to be having sex more and they want to know what's underneath that. So that's where low desire comes in. It's a comparison of a person's own timeline of desire for sex.

Andrea  20:23
Okay, thank you for specifying that giving a little bit more of a description. So where should people start? Should they first go and get their hormones checked? Should they read a book? Or what is your best advice?

Whitni  20:35
If you're a woman, the hormone part is the least. It's like the last thing I would check. And I know people are like, oh my gosh, what are you talking about? The thing about sex is yes, it is biological. Sure, sex is biological. But sex is way more psychological and socio cultural. Just like speaking to what you were talking about earlier with the purity culture, the shame, pressing on your desire to have sex. Those things are usually what the issue is way more so than oh, you've got low testosterone, you've got low estrogen, you know your progesterone and these things. And like I say about like, as far as hormones, the one that's probably going to mess with it the most is your dopamine levels. And you can work with that through exercise, getting into green spaces, trying new things. You don't have to go in and like, take medication. This is not addressing people who are going through perimenopause and menopause though because that is a situation where yes, I would absolutely go talk to your doctor about starting on HRT. I'm a huge, huge fan of like estradiol cream and things like that and making sure that sex isn't painful, making sure that you're not white knuckling it through vaginal dryness and stuff in an effort to please your partner. Your best sex use or like age 54 and up.

Andrea  21:55
Really? Oh my gosh.

Whitni  21:57
So there's a whole book about this. It's called Magnificent Sex: Lessons From Extraordinary Lovers. And it's a book it's a research study by Dr. Peggy Kleinplatz and Dr. Dana Menard. It's beautiful.

Andrea  22:08
I think I've heard of the first author.

Whitni  22:12
Oh, gosh, Dr. Peggy Kleinplatz is an amazing sexologist. She's amazing.

Andrea  22:17
Isn't she kind of a legend in the in that field and your industry?

Whitni  22:20
She is. She is. I've emailed her and she never emails me back. That's how big she is. Like I'm gonna keep trying because I'm trying so hard. But she says the average age for people having the most satisfying sex of their lives is age 54 in her study, it was like people aged 62 to 83 Having mind blowing sex.

Andrea  22:39
Wow.

Whitni  22:45
Yes. HRT if you need it.

Andrea  22:45
Okay. Yeah, I've had some other experts on and we'll put out some more that are coming out soon where we talk about this HRT, and every expert I've talked to is a fan of it, depending on the person, of course. But why else is it… I'm sure it has to do with the fact that you get to a certain age… I just recorded a solo podcast episode where I was talking about, because I'm 47 now and I, you know, I'm past the age where I really care a lot about what other people think. But then I saw people ahead of me who are women in their 50s who have truly embraced aging and truly don't care like they're just doing whatever they want. And I'm like no one's really talking about this in between space. Like this this bridge like I'm I feel like I'm on the bridge and I can see like I'm further down the river than where I was before but I'm what I make up is that they are at that place like where they just really like they have let go of the shame they are able to talk about what they want without feeling like their throat clenching up and their throat chakra is on fire. Like is that some of it are a lot of it?

Whitni  23:54
You absolutely nailed it right there. And you said you feel like you're getting close to that? I don't give a fuck about what you think?

Andrea  24:00
Yeah, like I feel like especially like when I'm in my 50s that I'm gonna reach it but I'm still a little bit in that like kind of liminal space of like, ah.

Whitni  24:09
Well, I'm 37 and I'm there. I'm like, go fuck yourself.

Andrea  24:13
I think I'm way ahead of a lot of people for you know, for other ways of like setting boundaries and like having other hard conversations and being able to emotionally regulate. That I have gotten down.

Whitni  24:24
You're doing so great. You're right on the right path. But exactly what you said is the I don't give a shit what you think. Like they have dropped those insecurities that they're at this place in their life where if you're rubbing their left labia instead of their clit, they are going to take your hand and put it right on there like this. This is where I want you to be.

Andrea  24:49
The show is sponsored by BetterHelp. And one of the keynotes that I give I'm talking about communication and I say something like would it be great if we all came with an owner's manual where you can just like hand it to whoever your someone you are in a relationship with like, the UPS delivery person, anyone, just to make your life so much easier. And I really do think that therapy is the next best thing, because therapists are trained to help you figure out the cause of whatever is triggering you or a challenging emotion, and they help you learn super productive coping skills. Those are just some of the benefits that I've gained from therapy over the last handful of decades. And if you have not tried therapy, or maybe if you're taking a break right now, I highly encourage you to check out BetterHelp. They are the world's largest therapy service, they've matched 3 million people with Professionally licensed and vetted therapists, and they're available 100% online. Plus, it's affordable, which is a huge bonus. It's super easy. You fill out a brief questionnaire, then they match you with a therapist. If things aren't really clicking, you can easily switch to a new one anytime. It's super simple. There's no waiting rooms, you don't have to sit in traffic, no endless searching online for the right therapist or waiting for someone to call you back to even tell you if they have availability. You can learn more and save 10% off your first month at  BetterHelp.com/kickass. That's BetterH-E-L-P.com/kickss.

I think for so many years, many of us, and when I say us, I mean, especially heterosexual women who are raised in this patriarchal culture, who are I think also of a certain age, I think millennial and Gen X women and probably baby boomer women who were taught, either implicitly or explicitly that sex is a performance for our male partner.

Whitni  26:41
Oh, duty sex.

Andrea  26:43
Is that what you guys call it?

Whitni  26:47
Fucking checklist duty six, it's terrible and it's never going to cultivate desire. You're never going to be like, I want some more of that.

Andrea  26:57
Like, I don't do that anymore but I certainly have been.

Whitni  27:01
We've all done it. I've been there. We've all done it. Like you're not a bad person if you've done it, you're just in there with the socio cultural norms of like the patriarchal society. Women 40 Plus, they're like, fuck that shit. And I hope to be a voice that is like getting down to the 20 year olds and being like, hey, fuck that shit. You know? Walking through that, like, it's terrible. No one is entitled to sex. Absolutely, no one is entitled to sex. It's another reason why I tell couples to stop leaning on spontaneity so much. I want sex to happen spontaneously with no effort, no prioritization, I'm like, do you feel owed? You feel like someone just owes you sex? Like, damn.

Andrea  27:42
Then that brings me to…I want to move into talking about arousal, you know, because you talk about spontaneous arousal versus responsive arousal. So can you kind of give us the ABCs of that.

Whitni  27:53
So it's desire. It's like spontaneous desire and responsive desire. The difference between arousal and desire is arousal is the physical response in your body, and desire is mental want. And sometimes, those things don't click. They don't match up. It's especially hard for women. Because women, we have a lower rate of interoception, which is knowledge about what's going on inside of our body. You know, maybe it's because we feel like pray all day that we kind of live in our head, and we don't really acknowledge what's going on in our body. But for whatever reason, men are statistically more body aware than women are. So they need time to get into their body.

Andrea  28:32
Women need more time.

Whitni  28:33
Yes.

Andrea  28:34
Okay.

Whitni  28:35
Yes. W little more time for the mind and body to sink. But spontaneous desire is you're just sitting around and you just think about sex and that's enough. You want to do it.

Andrea  28:43
That's typically how men experience…

Whitni  28:46
Yes. Men statistically, they experienced spontaneous desire more often than women do. The higher percentage of women who experienced responsive desire and that's the mental want. Showing up after they feel arousal. So they need to, they want to feel arousal in their body first, and not so much they want to it's just their experience. They feel arousal in their body first, and then they're like, oh, yeah, I want to have sex. And when I talked about this, men will be like, okay, well, let me just go over and grab your boobs and get that started. Like, that's terrible approach. Don't do that. That will make a woman feel a sense of obligation and shut her arousal.

Andrea  29:23
Like she’s pulling a casserole out of the oven?

Whitni  29:27
Yeah. Oh, my God. It's terrible. It's terrible. Because again, like I was saying, women are not connected to their body throughout the day. A large percentage of women are not so when you go over and you just grab her. It's just they feel obligated and they feel objectified, so they never get to the arousal and desire part. Instead, you want to invite them into their body first and then initiate sex. So you can do that with lighting candles, sexy music, compliments, you know, sensual massage. Like there are ways to approach this where it's like, it's an invitation to do you feel like getting in the mood. Instead of asking, are you in the mood.

Andrea  30:02
There was a Netflix or Hulu…was probably Netflix, a special and I cannot remember the name of it. Netflix has been doing a pretty good job, I think of showing some different doing great sex documentaries and docuseries. This particular one had different couples and I'll find it and put it in the show notes. And there was an expert that they had on there and I cannot remember her name, but she called it something like what's your sex archeatype or something like that and she had a quiz on her website where she…

Whitni  30:30
That's Jaiya, she's the somatic sexologist and The Erotic Blueprint. Yes.

Andrea  30:36
The Erotic Blueprint. That's what it was called. And it's like four different types. And you don't even need to go to the site because they she talks about them in depth in there. And then there was couples who they sort of profiled couples who had different ones. And it was so fascinating. And the reason I bring it up is because I love that she showed different ways people are aroused, all different ways.

Whitni  30:59
All different ways, all different ways. I love the Erotic Blueprint Quiz, because it shows how the specific people react to arousal or how they get to arousal. So it's like, if you find out your partner's erotic blueprint than you have just found out how to flood your partner with arousal.

Andrea  31:17
It's a sexual owner's manual.

Whitni  31:19
It is. It’s gorgeous.

Andrea  31:21
And it's so interesting. And so are people typically one or the other?

Whitni  31:24
With The Erotic Blueprint or the…?

Andrea  31:28
With how their arousal works. The spontaneous or the responsive.

Whitni  31:31
Oh yeah. Oh, so the here's the really crazy thing about that is like a lot of couples, when they first start dating, they'll both be experiencing spontaneous desire because you know, you're high on dopamine … You’re high on each other. A couple of years down the road, both or one of you could switch to responsive desire, and that can actually fluctuate from day to day, you know, I feel spontaneous on Tuesday and the rest of the week, I felt responsive. It's not fixed state. And it can very much depend on the context. Like if you have a deep, vulnerable conversation with your partner, and they receive you warmly and you look at them and are flooded with dopamine because they remind you of pleasure, you could be feeling spontaneous desire often that.

Andrea  32:11
Got it. Okay. When you said that sometimes on a Tuesday, especially as I've gotten a little bit older, I still spontaneous when I'm ovulating.

Whitni  32:18
Oh, yeah. If I'm on my period, I'm feral. It's weird. I'm like there's no opportunity for pregnancy hear at all, what is my body doing? But then I read about how you can feel easier access to arousal, because there's no fear of an unwanted pregnancy. That's how much like context can lean on you. Like if you think you might get pregnant by accident that can actually shut your arousal off.

Andrea  32:43
Yeah. Okay. What are some ways that couples can add more spice and make sex more playful? So I'm assuming there's kind of like some preliminary groundwork that needs to get out of the way. Like, you're like this is for couples that are not that are not having unresolved conflicts.

Whitni  32:59
Yet, like, if you think your partner's a dick, it's like, you gotta get that out of the way first.

Andrea  33:06
Yeah, this isn't like a sex will save you type of question.

Whitni  33:11
Right. So I love to instruct clients to invite playfulness and banter into their relationship. And that can be for some people like playing Twister. That's always a sexy good time. You know, with or without clothes on. That's up to you. I love getting couples to read erotica to each other because that can be like silly at first, like, you know, laugh about it. Oh, this is so silly and then all of a sudden, your cheeks are flush. And you're like, oh, I didn't know that about myself. You know, taking a walk with each other having a picnic in the living room. I love to like, make crab legs and just eat them in the living room with my partner. That's always fun. But anytime that you're gonna invite like lightness, playful banter, laughter, it's much easier to just ease that into a sexy good time afterwards. That takes the pressure off takes this sense of obligation off, we're just being here and invite you to be present. So presence is like, the best way to optimize sex. Like, the only way that sex gets great is if you're present for it.

Andrea  34:14
Yes, that's true. I'm laughing because I'm thinking of something that happened fairly recently. It really points to exactly what you were saying of many of us end of the day, we want to take our bra off. Those that are still sometimes wear bras and I do sometimes and I kind of mentioned it just offhandedly in the kitchen and I'm like, I need to go and take my bra off and my husband made a comment like do you need help with that? And I was like, are you sure you want to see this nude colored, full coverage bra? We both have a great sense of humor. But that I think is an example of that. Like I'm still inviting him in but also warning him like this these are not the lace underwire bras of the beginning of our relationship.

Whitni  35:06
No, I  love it. I love it because…

Andrea  35:10
Like so it’s no surprise when he sees it, but it just adds add some levity to the situation.

Whitni  35:15
Absolutely. I love it. No laughter is a beautiful lubrication.

Andrea  35:18
I had never really thought of that. I love that one more question. How does breathwork impact sexual pleasure? Because this is something I've never…I've done breath work, but it was not. It was separate from from sex and intimacy.

Whitni  35:34
Absolutely. Oh my gosh, I love this one. Every day I wake up with comments in my on my tic toc of people being like, my orgasm is stronger. It's longer. I can't believe this. A lot of times what we'll do, I don't know why we all know to do this, but it's something that we get into practicing and it hurts. We'll be masturbating or having sex with our partner, and will clench up their whole body and hold her breath and try to force an orgasm through her body. Have you ever experienced that?

Andrea  36:00
I don't know. Probably. I don't…I don't think I've like actually, you know, zoned in on the moment, but probably.

Whitni  36:03
You don't know if you've ever like held your breath to try to cum?

Andrea  36:08
I don't know. I'm gonna have to think about that the next time it happens. Yeah.

Whitni  36:12
Alright. Okay, think on that. So here's what happens. If you're either breathing very fast, or holding your breath, you have your parasympathetic nervous system, and you have your sympathetic nervous system. The sympathetic nervous system puts you into fight, flight, freeze, and your parasympathetic nervous system is for rest and digest. If you go too much into either one of these sides, it is not conducive for like a strong, fabulous orgasm. And it makes it really hard to have multiple orgasms. So if you're like breathing really fast, then that puts your body into firefight. It can also make you like lightheaded. And it can make the orgasm either like disappear fizzle out or be like meh. So like pairs in the nervous system is like, long, long exhales and like puts you into relaxation. So if you've done breath work, you've probably experienced being in your parasympathetic nervous system where you feel your shoulders drop away from your ears, you feel totally relaxed.

When you just breathe normally, like you're breathing right now as we're talking or tried to as you're having sex, you can actually dance between these two nervous systems. And that's called relaxed arousal. And what this does is it gives you optimal blood flow to your pelvis. And that increased blood flow increases your sensation. And if you have increased sensation, you can automatically like build up more arousal and the more arousal we build up, the more release we can have when there's an orgasm. And I've noticed through practicing this, it can be hard to remember not to hold your breath. So as the orgasm is coming, I'll say something like, wow, you know, and saying, wow, keeps that keeps me breathing, instead of trying to hold my breath. And what that'll do is it kind of extends the orgasm. It makes it last longer. And then if you'll like use indirect stimulation for people who get hypersensitive after the orgasm, yeah, you can actually build to the next one, much easier. So it's a practice. It's not a perfect, it's not a light switch. And at first, you'll be like conflicted about breathing because people tell me what, it's hard for me to concentrate on breathing and doing the same time and that decreases arousal, because you're all like, am I breathing? Am I not? And I don't want to like make it more confusing, but just try to breathe normally or tell your partner that you're practicing that so they can get in your ear and whisper like breathe baby. Which is hot.

Andrea  38:38
That's so fascinating. I've never put that together before but I did say that that was my last question. But I do have one more question because you made talking about orgasms you made me think of something that I wanted to use to ask because it was one of those Netflix documentaries where…and I think Emily Nagurski was talking about it where they just recently in the 90s I think finally did some research on the female clitoris. And so it seems that, and please correct me if I'm wrong, because for years, they talked about the g spot that was like inside of the vagina like on the on the kind of the upper side. And as it turns out, is it correct that that is actually the other side of the clitoris?

Whitni  39:21
Oh my gosh, there's so much speculation going on right now because actually, there's been a study that was released talking about how women have a prostate. It was just mind blowing. So you know how like men have a prostate and it's shaped like a walnut. Okay, and you can stimulate a man's prostate through like anal penetration and some men some are not but it's a very strong orgasm, stimulating the prostate through annual penetration. So that G spot area is your urethral sponge. It feels different inside of the vagina is very spongy area especially in a very aroused state you'll get in gorged. But right on the other side of that urethral sponge is actually where the female prostate is it wraps around the urethra there. And it looks like from the studies that I've been looking at that that is what's being stimulated when you're stimulating the g spot and a spot which is your interior fornix that's just a little further up behind the G spot, but in the same area as far as pressing up toward the navel when you're inside doing vaginal penetration. So in an aroused state with blood flow increased into that area, it looks like that, that the prostate is what is being stimulated. So the same as a man experiencing increased stimulation, increased pleasure from stimulating a prostate, it looks like it's the same for women. Which makes sense because the clitoris is the homologue to the you know, penis and everybody has a prostate. So stimulating one's prostate increases pleasure.

Andrea  40:59
Fascinating. I didn't know that there was like still research going on about it. Because I've had you know, quote, unquote, vaginal orgasms before and they feel different.

Whitni  41:10
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Andrea  41:12
They feel different. It feels like an entire body sort of like waves and it's a slower to build and they're longer. With clitoral orgasms they're sharper and they're faster. Almost feels like almost like a slap in the face.

Whitni  41:27
They do. They do feel like a slap in the face. And what's crazy is like I need that clitoral like external clitoral orgasm first and then it's so much easier for me to get those vaginally penetrative orgasms after that.

Andrea  41:40
I've never noticed if that's the case with me but they are different. All of it is fascinating to me, because it's definitely not my area of expertise only you know, anecdotally in my own experience.

Thank you so much. And then where do you want people to go if they want to learn more about you to grab your stuff?

Whitni  41:56
Absolutely. If you'd like to just check me out get to know me you want to come to my TikTok and that's @bBDEMoves. M-O-V-E-S all one word by the way.

Andrea  42:07
Is that an acronym?

Whitni  42:08
Yes, it stands for Big Dick Energy Moves.

Andrea  42:10
Got it. Why do I not know that from the beginning.

Whitni  42:15
Like if you care about female sexuality, that is great big dick energy. So you can check me out. If you like what I'm doing over there and you want more in depth, please use the link that's in my bio there to come to my Patreon which is also underneath BDEMoves and that's where you'll find all of my uncensored content and it's just $15 a month.

Andrea  42:34
Well, I just want to like quickly read through the playlists that you have on TikTok you have. You have videos on struggling to orgasm, different desires, BDSM, initiating, stress cycles, boudoir. So many different things. Belly breathing. Even attachment theory, which we've talked about here on the show. People that struggle with low desire, pleasure based, even strappy sandals, I think is what you call it, You don't have a guideline violation on TokTok. So many different and much more even explicit than we have talked about here. But I appreciate you so much. Thank you for saying yes. I will continue to tell people about you and your work. And it's so, so important. And everyone, thank you so much for being here. I'm so grateful for your time. It's incredibly valuable. And remember, it's our life's journey to make ourselves better humans and our life's responsibility to make the world a better place.

Hey, did you know there's free secret podcast episodes waiting for you that are not part of my regular podcast feed? Yes. AndreaOwen.com/free and you just sign up, you get a link sent to you. It's very secret. It's like a secret club. We don't have a secret handshake. Don't worry about that. But it's these motivating podcast episodes that I made for you. They're under 20 minutes each. There's three of them. There for wherever you are in your life. So head on over there and grab them. They range from really supporting you and seeing you where you are and being compassionate all the way to giving you a giant kicking your ass and telling you how amazing and gorgeous and phenomenal you are. So AndreaOwen.com/free and get your hands on that free podcast feed.

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